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Author Topic: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards  (Read 4415 times)

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Offline BurstOfAnger

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Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« on: February 08, 2012, 10:10:07 PM »
Hey guys, I have a Joytron Pro Fighter P stick and I've got this issue.

Sometimes when I input 2A 5B for example, my stick suddenly bounces up and inputs 8, so instead I do 2A jump. Even when I do 3A 5B to do a low A, it still bounces to input 8. It happens about 1 in 5 times. It's really difficult to do it on purpose as even if I flick my stick down vigorously (please keep in context), it doesn't actually happen.

However, I might have found a cause. I hold the stick between my middle and ring finger and my palm faces upwards. If I have my fingers curl in to hold the stick down, then release my fingers to let it go to neutral, I find that if my ring finger just barely touches the stick while uncurling, it occasionally causes my stick to input up, so I jump.
^Doesn't seem to be true anymore, after further testing.

Any way to work around this? I'm new to stick and I've found myself quite comfortable with this grip except for this problem. Should I learn a new grip or is there a workaround this problem by changing my style of using this grip? Or perhaps is there any way to lower the sensitivity of my stick through software or modding?

Also, sorry if I put this in the wrong section because maybe it isn't tech related after all.

EDIT: Here's how the input display looks like when it happens. Here, I try to input 6AB to dash in, 3A to do a low A, then let go of my stick to neutral to input 5B. It only happens when I'm facing to the left. The 2A does manage to come out and hit, but then gets cancelled to a jump:

« Last Edit: February 08, 2012, 10:26:51 PM by BurstOfAnger »
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Offline Numakie

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2012, 10:32:23 PM »
You sure the joystick just doesn't press up when you flick the stick around?

I have that problem when it came to My AH2 Hori stick. As a test, I flicked the 2 direction and let the joystick go back to netural.  1 out of 3 times, the up direction would be pressed.  I attempted to tighten the spring on my stick, and, while it improved it a bit, still has that problem.  During casuals last weekend, it costed me numerous rounds. 

This doesn't happen with my modded Tekken 5 stick.
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Offline BurstOfAnger

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2012, 10:41:40 PM »


Seems to be fine. Though, I might have found the REAL cause this time.

I finally noticed that when I put my stick on my lap, it's slanted outwards, meaning that it is slanted in the direction where "up" of the stick is facing. I'm guessing that gravity is pulling on my stick, so when I let go of it to go to neutral, it has a tendency to bounce and input "up". If I overcompensate this by tilting my stick towards me (please keep in context), it seems to solve the problem. I'll need further testing.
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Offline pk

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2012, 11:20:55 PM »
(keeping everything in context)

Indeed, holding your stick at a downward angle can cause the joystick to flick instead of going straight to neutral. You want to keep it relatively level while playing.

Looks like Joy Tron is a Korean company, maybe the parts are Korean too. Those pushbuttons don't look like your typical Japanese Sanwa or Seimitsu parts. The joystick on the otherhand, looks identical to a Sanwa JLF.

Also, from the way you describe it, it sounds like you use the same hand position as desk. If it works for him, it should work for you.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2012, 11:35:38 AM by pk »

Offline BurstOfAnger

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2012, 11:41:52 PM »
I personally don't know any difference between Korean and Japanese sticks and parts, so I don't know how those matter. Also, my grip is something like his, but my palm is facing up.
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Offline Komidol

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2012, 10:29:56 AM »
This effect happens when the stick is mounted too high.  You may have small hands and have to lower the stick down a bit.  This is also a common problem of new stick users, who focus their hand on the shaft of the stick too much, and not using the ball to move the stick.  When you execute you should, regardless of what way you hold it, primarily only be holding the ball. 

This results in the case you have extremely small hands, and need to lower it.  The stick may of be tremendously shitty quality.  It may of just been placed higher for some reason during assembly.  The dust cover or dust washer inside may be out of place (if you have one).  If you had this stick modded or made from scratch the possibility of it just being a bad mount are increase 10 fold, no matter how center it looks. 
 
I remember on my first arcade stick mod I had not used a mount and screwed in the joystick plate too tightly, resulting in a high-sitting upward-tilt.  The mount was just done too securely and if I pulled all the way back on the stick on let the ball go there was a 1/5 chance it would ricochet up.  I noticed this once maybe every other match, it would mis-input because of this effect.

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Offline Numakie

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2012, 12:37:04 PM »
This effect happens when the stick is mounted too high

Hmm... ya think a temporary fix would be to raise the surface around the stick so your hand is naturally closer to the ball?  Was thinkin of... iunno... a couple of old mouse pads. Just cut a hole in it and lay it down on the stick, then anchor it down with adhesive or tape.

If it works, then sweet. I'm a genius.  :prinny:
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Offline Komidol

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2012, 12:45:35 PM »
The best temp fix is to throw in a couple washers on the Stick's underside beneath the screws so the joystick will lower itself by the width of the washer
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Offline BurstOfAnger

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2012, 06:41:58 PM »
^Yep, that's exactly my stick, only that mine is black.

If best, I'd like to avoid modding it because there aren't many places near me that supply parts. I could try opening it up and looking inside, but for now my temporary fix seems to be working, that is tilting the stick towards me by placing something underneath where the extra buttons are (based on the above pic). You guys might be right about it using imitation parts; stuff like that is really common around here, and I didn't bother to check when I bought it.

@Komidol: As far as I can notice, I believe I'm quite primarily holding the ball, though I do touch the shaft a bit (oh god the context!!) because I hold the base of the ball where it touches the shaft. Being Asian, I do have small hands, but I can try just holding the ball. Also, based on VietGeek's pic, do you think the stick's mounted too high?
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Offline pk

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2012, 08:29:40 PM »
Also, based on VietGeek's pic, do you think the stick's mounted too high?

Measure. HORI sets the height to about 23.5 mm, and Madcatz about 22.5 mm. If your height is wildly different then you probably need to adjust the stick.

Offline BurstOfAnger

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2012, 11:12:15 PM »
Doing my best to measure using a ruler, the shaft itself is about 25-26mm. The base up till the tip of the ball is about 58-60mm. I'll measure properly using measuring tape when I can find it.

At any rate, is a change of 3 mm significant?
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Offline Tigre

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2012, 12:32:18 AM »
The stick being mounted too high would not effect this problem. The stick is traveling the same distance regardless.
This is a problem with the stick having too much spring and not returning to neutral after an input is made, a proper solution would be to switch out the spring inside the stick for a softer/harder spring, so that you won't have as much force returning to neutral. Another option would be to shorten the existing spring, although I would highly advise against that, for fairly obvious reasons (You've got no stock part to return to)
Sadly with these sorts of sticks they're not always engineered the best, so it's somewhat of a crapshoot.
While joytron is a korean company, there is no way in fuck that this thing is holding a korean stick.
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Offline FireBearHero

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Re: Stick problem - Suddenly flicks upwards
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2012, 01:28:38 PM »
It's also a rare problem caused by the game.
The fix for me was to just remap my stick through the config. Just remap the exact same things. Works fine.