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Author Topic: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~  (Read 29310 times)

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Offline F9|Chibi

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The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« on: October 19, 2008, 09:33:34 PM »
At first I was wondering why there wasn't many Hisui vids available online, I attributed it to the Japanese still trying to figure her out.

Well turns out that they nerfed her quite a bit and she plays almost exactly the same, to the point where it's actually boring really. Anyways, I took alot of notes and I'm going to outline what I have here for you guys, but be warned it might not all be 100% correct (more like 99% at this point). I'll continue to confirm things as I keep playing.

Full Moon Hisui-

Plays nothing like MBAC Hisui.

Ground Normals:

5A - That tiny little poke (aka you are the criminal) that barely extends past her face. Has a surprisingly big enough hitbox to where it will still hit people crouching.

5b - Extends her arms out to either side of her body, holding a ladle in one hand. Seems to have some amount of frame advantage on block. Can also be charged.

4B - Watering can. Still does 30%.

5c - Same old chair. Will have to check up on the clash frames.

2A - Hisui takes out a little spoon while closing her eyes, has almost NON EXISTANT range. You have to be absurdly close to have this hit. Mashing this on wake up will get you absolutely shit. Pretty sure this does not hit low.

2B - Same old double palm strike. Have to check up on clash frames. Still hits low.

2C - Same bucket / washcloth wipe, same speed.

3C,C - First hit is her old 6B, looks to have clash frames on it. Second hit is an extension to it, she swings in the same arc with another ladle. This is her launcher.

6[C] - What used to be the second part of the 6c,[c],236c motion in MBAC is now a worthwhile overhead option, charges fast. Use often.

j.A - same it's always been.

j.B - She extends her arms outwards to either side, with one hand holding a washcloth. The hitbox on this move sucks ass, and you would think it'd be perfect to use as a cross up, but it's no good for that either. It works better as a fuzzy guard then her old j.B did though.

j.C - Long ass lampost. Extends itself almost as far as Nero's j.C. Unless you're right ontop of your opponent it's almost impossible to combo from.

j.2C - Same old loveable x-chop.

I'm pretty sure air dust is a command normal because I couldn't find it out otherwise doing normal special motions available in MB. If I'm missing something you've seen in vids, tell me please.

Specials:

236-a: Short ladle rush, ends with a swipe, good to use for counter hit set up, cancelable on block.
     -b: Little longer ladle rush, ends with a launch, can follow up with 2b / 5b into bnb etc (not entirely 100% on this).
     -c: Ex ladle. Same old crap.

214x-a/b/c/ (x denotes a direction) - Same old stuff-fu that you should know how to operate by now.

623-a: Anti air frying pan, Hisui lifts a frying pan just a tiny bit above her head. Not all that good, but has a decent hitbox.
     -b: Anti air mop, very tall vertical reach, used in BnB. Works well when dashing under the opponent, definitely not better then old AA dust.
     -c: Ex ladder. Wall slams. Trades with everything on wake up, but pretty damn good. Worth using often.

22-a: What used to be 22C in MBAC, aka THIS CHAIR.
   -b: Rolling office chair, slow to start moving. If opponent hits this it will clash and then roll back to you, where you can then hit it (will clash again) and destroy it. Travels almost half screen.
   -c: Ex throne. Takes two hits. Meh. Not as good as I was hoping it would be.

j.236a/b/c: Same old ex ladle shit. Can follow up with dumb combo, etc.

Bread and Booters:

For all purposes her BnB seems to be 2abc,3cc, 623B, jb, djb, djc, air throw. You can combo after the first or second hit of the 3cc without the need to do 623b if you so wish. That's it. Yes I'm serious.

Half Moon Hisui-

Plays very, very closely to her MBAC counterpart, just, worse. D:

Ground Normals:

5A - Same as Full Moon.

5B - Old 5B, not sure of clash frames.

4b - Watering can, same shit.

6b - Old Launching ladle.

5C - Old 5C, not sure of clash frames.

6c,[c], 236 - Same old rekkas, second portion is overhead when charged obviously.

2A - Old 2A, hooray.

2b - Old 2b.

2c - Old 2c.

j.A - Same old.

j.b - Full moon j.B.

j.C - Same old table.

j.2c - Old xchop.

Specials:

236-a: Same as full moon.
     -b: Same as full moon (not entirely sure on follow up).
     -c: Same as full moon.

j236-a/b/c: Same old shit.

214-a: Ok here is the big difference. Remember in MBAC how 2146B gave you tray book (a full screen fast projectile in the form of a tray and the book)? Well in Half Moon 214 and ANY DIRECTION will always give you tray, and just tray. Always, no matter what, you will not get anything else. Ciel can dash under this, dumb bitch.

    -b: And doing 214b will always, always, always give you pot books, no matter what.

    -c: Ex-stuff fu, sucks.

22-a: Old A bento.
   -b: Old B Bento.
   -c: Footstool! You can put four of these out along with having two bentos out. The hitbox is far smaller then old 22c chair, but it's 100% more reliable because it will always clash with an attack instead of it randomly not doing so. There is no ex version of this move.

623-a: MBAC ground dust.
     -b: AA dust, still good, still has upperbody invincibility, and cancelable on whiff / hit.
     -c: ex dust, still great in corner, SHIT elsewhere, will explain in better detail later.

Bread and Booter:

2abc, 5c, 6c, jb, jc, djb, djc, air throw. Input of air combo is much slower then MBAC counterpart.

Her new BnB involving a relaunch is (I could be completely wrong about this)

2abc, 6b, j[c]ab, land jb, jc, air throw?

Crescent Hisui-

Same god damn shit as MBAC, but I'm pretty damn sure this is her best groove as you get her tech punish options.

Ground Normals:

5a - Same as MBAC.

5b - Same as MBAC.

4b - Same as MBAC.
6b - Same as MBAC.

5c - Same as MBAC.

6c,[c], 236 - Same as MBAC.

2a - Same as MBAC.

2b - Same as MBAC.

2c - Same as MBAC.

j.a - Same as MBAC.

j.b,b - Same as MBAC.

j.c - Same as MBAC.

j.2c - Same as MBAC.

Specials:

236-x: I will have to check up on this, but I think this all versions of 236x are of its mbac counterpart and not full / half moon.

214x-a/b/c (x denotes a direction) - Same as MBAC.

623-a: Same as MBAC.
     -b: Same as MBAC.
     -c: Same as MBAC, but nerfed.

22-a: Old A bento.
    -b: Old B bento.
    -c: Ex bento, nothing special about it at all. Not joking.

Bread and Booter:

Same as MBAC, including tech punishes.

General Notes-

Again, I don't know how to do air dust yet, but I believe it's available in all grooves.

You can no longer do dust loop in any form, the dust knocks them too far away to hit them back into it. You can combo into it from a 5C in the corner, but not after say hitting your opponent with a 5C midscreen. Ex-dust may be more then 5 hits this time, will have to check on that.

Arc drive still works as a wake up / reversal, but good luck comboing after it. It will only hit 1-3 times if you do not hold it, and even then you have to be
at a certain distance to do so, much harder then it was in MBAC. Still looks to be unair blockable / shieldable though.

Ex-throne seems to be able to clash with crap even when placed behind the opponent, odd.

Doing chair / bento in the corner can still have them end up off screen, lame.

Block strings using the new 5A are fun.

Realistically speaking, I can't say that Full Moon doesn't have potential, but I feel more like describing it as it being her only option for offering a new experience really. Time will tell though. Can't say I'm happy with what they did to her, some of the changes make no sense, and she plays far too much like her MBAC counterpart to be entirely enjoyable when everyone else has this absurd amount of new sillyness to work with. More disappointed then anything.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2008, 09:41:38 PM by Master Chibi »
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Offline CT_Warrior

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2008, 10:41:22 PM »
So MBAC to Cresent-Moon differences:

-Airthrow nerfed.
-Loss of chair for EX obento (maybe it can punish backdash too? *shrugs*)
-Dust loop combo is gone.

Well, I can live with loss of chair and dust combo because I never really used them, but the airthrow nerf is a bit sad, although lots of other characters got their airthrows nerfed too.


Full Moon almost seems retarded in a way since you lose jBB and obento setups and a lot of the old decent normals for weaker or different ones that you may not be able to combo from, and you can't rebeat anymore.
Half Moon, you lose jBB, but you get all the half-moon broken shit and possibly better normals, time will tell for that. But I'm pretty confident that full moon sucks compared to her other styles.

Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2008, 10:54:37 PM »
Her aithrow is nerfed in all grooves. You can tech punish after it, but it's the old 3 way guess it's always been, and that's just not in your favor obviously. Kiss those post airthrow mix ups good bye man.

Quote
Half Moon, you lose jBB, but you get all the half-moon broken shit and possibly better normals, time will tell for that. But I'm pretty confident that full moon sucks compared to her other styles.

What half moon broken shit? She's totally 'normal' in a game that's full of silly dumb shit right now. All those crazy tools they showed off like before the public release like ex-throne, and ladder are hardly worth noting. The entire time I was playing D: is the only face I can muster up.
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puKKa

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2008, 12:19:27 AM »
 :psyduck:
And I was hoping MBAA would give a change to hisui so it'd feel fresh to play her again.. Maybe it's time to go for that kouma..

Offline CT_Warrior

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2008, 04:06:34 PM »
Well I guess broken was the wrong word.
I was referring to the 200% autospark and super quick HP gain.

Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2008, 09:45:29 PM »
If you guys want me to test / try anything please let me know, as I don't plan on playing her much this weekend otherwise.
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Offline Lord Knight

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2008, 10:05:57 PM »
The entire time I was playing D: is the only face I can muster up.

Really guys, this is true.
Keep climbin', gotta get to the top

Offline Sphyra

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2008, 06:05:34 AM »
I am some kind of Divination God.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2008, 07:28:40 AM by Sphyra »
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Offline Draku

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2008, 12:15:18 AM »
She's totally 'normal' in a game that's full of silly dumb shit right now.
Haha, that's oddly fitting for Hisui...

Offline Sphyra

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2008, 01:19:57 PM »
Well it seems C-Hisui hasn't been only losing. From recent vids I found out she can now combo from 2C 6B on the ground by following with j.[C]AB land jump air combo. What this means is that now she gets a valid high low game using her 6C 6[C] 236C 5AB air combo or 6C delay 2C 6B air combo. Using this with the cover of Ex Dust to make it more safe would probably be a nice thing too. Mix that up with her already strong tick throw game and you may just get a viable and more interesting character.

I don't know if this works for H-Hisui too and honestly I don't care much at all for that style with her.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2008, 01:31:10 PM by Sphyra »
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Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2008, 05:44:33 PM »
I'll try that combo on Saturday, but honestly that's not enough for me to consider her 'interesting' again, it's laughable at this point really.

:\
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Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2008, 09:07:04 PM »
Ok, one good thing to note:

You can hold watering can now for upwards of 2-3 seconds.

It will knock the opponent down, take off 30%, and then continue to deplete their meter while they're on the floor. I've been able to get rid of 120% meter easily in one shot.
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Offline ಠ_ಠ Dizzynecro

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #12 on: October 28, 2008, 09:05:19 PM »
I've been able to get rid of 120% meter easily in one shot.
:slowpoke:

By the way, Are Melty Blood and Melty Bread different games?

puKKa

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2008, 01:29:41 AM »
Sadly, people don't die from having no meter  :prinny:

Offline Curbeh

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2008, 01:48:34 PM »
Eh, you were not kidding about the nerf...
Will you change characters?
They can't get enough of me

Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #15 on: October 29, 2008, 04:32:44 PM »
No, but I will be playing two characters now for sure. Unless some freakishly beastily shit gets discovered for Hisui (which I highly, highly doubt) I've literally learned all she's got already.
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Offline Sphyra

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #16 on: October 30, 2008, 05:37:50 AM »
Don't give in to astonishment!

puKKa

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #17 on: October 30, 2008, 08:25:15 AM »
As it looks now, hisui dosnt really seem to be that fun.. I'm thinking of poking that MHisui or a Kohaku, or maybe maids, cause one can't stop playing a maid!

Offline Sphyra

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #18 on: October 30, 2008, 10:05:35 AM »
F-Akiha stole my heart with her held puddles.

rename thread to whos ur new main lolol

sad hisui  :(
« Last Edit: October 30, 2008, 10:07:10 AM by Sphyra »
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Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #19 on: October 30, 2008, 06:09:43 PM »
As it looks now, hisui dosnt really seem to be that fun.. I'm thinking of poking that MHisui or a Kohaku, or maybe maids, cause one can't stop playing a maid!

Don't bother playing Hisui lead either, it's equally as ugly / lame.

I mean, I'm not trying to keep anyone from playing her if they really want to, but I have warned all of you of the changes, so don't be surprised.
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Offline Tsubasa☆

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #20 on: October 30, 2008, 07:54:23 PM »
I have yet to play MBAA, but, from what I see and hear, I am likewise disenchanted by the "new" Hisui.  I'm not sure if I can continue playing her either.  C-Arc and H-Ren look tempting. -.-;
-Tsubasa

puKKa

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #21 on: October 31, 2008, 07:07:58 AM »
Don't bother playing Hisui lead either, it's equally as ugly / lame.

Now why would I play a gimped version of the maids? -_-;;
Kohaku is cute enough, and that charged low foot-attack is just too awesome.

Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #22 on: November 02, 2008, 10:51:56 PM »
Ok so I lied to myself, I can't bare NOT to play Hisui, given all the work I put into learning her in MBAC, so I'm going to keep at it. I'll have to make Full Moon work somehow, and learn her combo in Crescent.

Other things of note:

Without j.BB in her arsenal I've been doing iad back 6b, and I dare say it works better for run away then j.BB did.

While j.BB helped establish more distance quicker, 6b will actually just outright smack people in the face who are chasing you if they don't space themselves properly. Quickly landing and doing 623B does wonders when you know they won't run right at you.

In half moon, 236a/b/c are all automatic (I believe), as in you don't need to input the ender.

I'm pretty sure you can actually use 4B as part of actual block strings now (as in there's no pause between normals, you can go right into it).

In half moon 214A has to be the fasted projectile in the game. Faster then Ciel knives, and power wave from Aoko.

More as I figure shit out~
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puKKa

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #23 on: November 03, 2008, 12:13:03 AM »
Ok so I lied to myself, I can't bare NOT to play Hisui, given all the work I put into learning her in MBAC, so I'm going to keep at it. I'll have to make Full Moon work somehow, and learn her combo in Crescent.

Other things of note:

Without j.BB in her arsenal I've been doing iad back 6b, and I dare say it works better for run away then j.BB did.

While j.BB helped establish more distance quicker, 6b will actually just outright smack people in the face who are chasing you if they don't space themselves properly. Quickly landing and doing 623B does wonders when you know they won't run right at you.

In half moon, 236a/b/c are all automatic (I believe), as in you don't need to input the ender.

I'm pretty sure you can actually use 4B as part of actual block strings now (as in there's no pause between normals, you can go right into it).

In half moon 214A has to be the fasted projectile in the game. Faster then Ciel knives, and power wave from Aoko.

More as I figure shit out~

go for it, prove she's worth playing :3

Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: The Tragedy That is MBAA Hisui~
« Reply #24 on: November 03, 2008, 09:46:18 PM »
Oh she's still worth playing, and she can definitely still win (she's not unplayable by any means, not even close), it's just that she doesn't get anything new to fuck around with per-se (until Full Moon gets messed around with) and what you're already used to is iffy on working in your favor. She's like that player on the football team that everyone tends to forget is there, until she happens to land a touchdown out of nowhere, then she goes back to being obscure again.

Also the GIANT BUTTS BEHIND THIS GAME are supposedly changing her 4B with the newest revision, resulting with her one beastly change to likely end up going straight to hell.

Douchebags.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 09:53:59 PM by F9|Chibi »
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