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Author Topic: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)  (Read 23609 times)

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Offline Kamina

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Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« on: October 03, 2011, 07:28:27 PM »
1.05  - CC 1.07 Changes
全スタイル共通
For all styles
強化点 Buffs
空中兜神にアーマー追加
All 22A/B/C air teleports now have armor added to them
圧壊派生623Cが画面端まで吹き飛ばし。有利時間増加。
The EX after 214 grabs now blow away the opponent to the corner. Added frame advantage time.
弱体化点Nerfs
J22A,Bが空中ビートをリセットしなくなった。JA>A兜>JAはできない。
You can't use teleports to rebeat after you've used a normal. For example, j.a>teleport>j.a can't be done anymore.

クレセントムーン
Crescent
強化点 Buffs
5B派生Bのノックバック減少。コンボに組み込める。
5B(B) has less knockback, so you can now better perform combos.
C布薩掌派生236Cが画面端まで吹き飛ばし。地上受身可能でダウン追い討ち不能。
The C version of the rekka after 236C blows opponents to the corner. You can't continue on the ground since they can tech on the ground.
A兜神にダウン引き剥がし追加。(追撃不能。意味無し)
22A can OTG relauch. (But you can't follow up, it makes no sense)
J214Bにダウン引き剥がし追加。
J214B can OTG relaunch.
6Cが空中HITで地面バウンド。追撃可能。ダウン引き剥がし追加。
When hit with 6C from the air, it causes bounce and its possible to follow up. It can also OTG relaunch.
J214Aが着地硬直をEXキャンセル可能に。
J214 A can EX cancel upon landing on the ground with it.

弱体化点  Nerfs
なし? None?

フルムーンスタイル
Full Moon
強化点 Buffs
2B補正緩和(70%→80%?)
Proration on 2B is increases 70%- >80%
623Aダメージ増加?(2000→2200?)
623A damage was increased? 2000->2200
兜神にダウン引き剥がし追加。Bは追撃可能。
22 moves can OTG relaunch, can follow up after 22B.
J214Aが着地硬直をEXキャンセル可能に。
J214A can EX cancel on block.
J214Bにダウン引き剥がし追加。
J214B can OTG relaunch.
BE2Cのノックバック減少。
The knockback on BE2C was decreased.

弱体化点 Nerfs
623Bのダメージ減少(2200→1500?)、補正追加。(100%→80%?)
The damage on 623B was decreased and has added proration (2200 -> 1500) (100% -> 80%)
通常投げに補正追加。
Normal throw has increased proration

ハーフムーンスタイル 
Half Moon
強化点 BUffs
236Cが受身不能時間増加。地面に付くまで完全に空中受身不能。
Increased untechable time on 236C. Its not possible to tech until they reach the ground.
5A>6A>6Aの前進量増加。
5A>6A>6A advances you further.
2Cがクレセントと同じ性能に(リーチ増、上方向の判定微増)
2C is now the same as crescent moon (The reach is extended, and the hitbox was improved)
圧壊後ろ派生の補正緩和。
The proration on 214 wall slam was increased.
J22Bの軌道変更(上40°位に上昇する)動作終了後に振り向くように。
J22B teleport's direction has changed and now goes 40 degrees upward. At the end of the movement animation, you can change sides.
5B持続増加
5B is active longer(?)
623A判定強化
Hitbox for 623A has improved
J236C補正緩和
J236C's proration was increased

弱体化点 Nerfs
なし? None?

Correct me if I'm off on anything, all 5 and a half of you.

http://youtu.be/SegFWVWsy4M?t=3m20s
Check out 22B relaunch ridiculousness here by Hirata.

http://youtu.be/g3Ea0R-q9ks?t=1m20s
Some Half and Crescent play by Sena Airi, just LOOK at that untech time on 236C, you ain't going nowhere!
Theres also that nifty teleport at 1:27, dem angles yo

http://youtu.be/WJHaYbP-dDI?t=16m36s
Right here you can see more of Sena as he demonstrates that new half court shot Kouma's been developing.

« Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 12:50:01 AM by Kamina »

Offline Inso

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2011, 11:20:52 PM »
空中兜神にアーマー追加
All 22A/B/C teleports now have armor added to them
Isn't it air teleports?
Well, I guess it's the same if you specificaly say all of them.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2011, 11:51:39 PM by Inso »
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Offline LordPangTong

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2011, 07:56:51 AM »
Were H-Kouma's j.22b the only one that got the angle change? I thought I saw a C-Kouma do it too
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Offline Kamina

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2011, 08:43:32 AM »
空中兜神にアーマー追加
All 22A/B/C teleports now have armor added to them
Isn't it air teleports?
Well, I guess it's the same if you specificaly say all of them.
Fixed.
Were H-Kouma's j.22b the only one that got the angle change? I thought I saw a C-Kouma do it too
You sure about that LPT? If you've got some solid evidence feel FREE to share

Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2011, 10:41:15 AM »
So should I delete the other thread that I started or move the video links I posted to this one since this seems more efficient.
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Offline Kamina

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2011, 11:40:13 AM »
So should I delete the other thread that I started or move the video links I posted to this one since this seems more efficient.
Don't worry dumba, I got it now. You can just let the other thread sleep with the fishes.

Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2011, 07:09:12 PM »
So should I delete the other thread that I started or move the video links I posted to this one since this seems more efficient.
Don't worry dumba, I got it now. You can just let the other thread sleep with the fishes.

Gotcha & I love the descriptions you have for the vids  ;)
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Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2011, 06:26:20 PM »
During watching recent new vids of Kaimaato, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFNmYZLJCA8&feature=feedu, I noticed after counter hits or command grabs, F-Kouma can now do 2c into rekka BnB for extra damage, haven't really noticed anything else dramatically different transitioning from 1.05 to 1.07. Kamina if you can update the OP with 1.07 changes for all moons that'd be greately appreciated and one more thing,  can someone with access to the game confirm if techable or non-techable 5b 2b 22b 623b loop is still in 1.07.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2011, 09:20:12 AM by HowIsThatOatmeal »
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Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2011, 09:33:04 AM »
"OS" that I stumbled upon while playing around with F-Kouma:
214B ~ 623C (If 214B is confirmed, 623C must be done IMMEDIATELY after 214B is confirmed for EX facepalm. If whiffed, anti-air 623c comes out for EX grab which is air unblockable)

Useful situations which it applies to: With MAX meter & want to rid of it, when opponent has little life & needs around 2.5K-3K to be killed, or if they're trying to jump out of your corner pressure. These are the situations that I've found though so someone else may find another likely scenario & if so feel free to share info.

Oddly enough as I made this post, a random Acho vid http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AljHV3ic7GM&list=PLC81F2134C6122EF9&index=104&feature=plpp_video pops up where someone is using it, fast forward to around 48:30 to see the player in action.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2011, 04:25:25 PM by HowIsThatOatmeal »
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Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2011, 04:29:35 PM »
Not necessarily changes but just wanted to let people who are interested in Kouma that I've begun to post timestamps on vids from GameACHO, Kirisugu, etc. on YouTube so in case the uploader didn't post them or did not intend to do so, just look for it on the comments.
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Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.05)
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2012, 09:46:54 AM »
So F-Kouma feels buffed from console & aside the changes from 1.05, nothing else has been changed from the character. H-Kouma is definitely better from console by far, actual Oki options on knockdown from typical BnB combos & setups, how many there are is a different question because it seems that you can do literal which ways on most combos now from midscreen but I'll continue to test as much as possible this week. Since I nor anyone who was serious never used H-Kouma in console I'll post this up: moves with clash properties 236A, 236B (Both parts of rekka), 2B aka da gawd, j.C, 5C, and 6C, which are basically F-Moons normals so they transfer to this character as well, hope this helps & if anyone finds anything wrong with my notes so far, please say so.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2012, 03:17:11 PM by Malik »
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Offline Kamina

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2012, 12:49:02 AM »
This just in from the lab! I made a nice little tutorial video on Kouma's normals and basic combo~
El Psy Congroo~
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTX4-QYLlMs&feature=youtu.be

Offline Irysa

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2012, 07:02:21 AM »
Is it just me, or does F-Kouma's bnb feel easier now when using 236b instead of 236a?

Like, doing 2aa 5b 2b 2c 236b 236b 236[c] 2a 6c j[c] dj[c] land 623a feels a bit more leniant than it did on console for me. However I only rarely alted Kouma so I was just wondering if anybody with more experience with him in console could notice any changes.
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Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2012, 12:21:48 PM »
This just in from the lab! I made a nice little tutorial video on Kouma's normals and basic combo~
El Psy Congroo~
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTX4-QYLlMs&feature=youtu.be

Nice tutorial going over his normals & what situations they're used for, just a bit of a spelling error at the end with 4:20 & yeah 6C is pretty much just used for some stagger strings such as 6C>22B or 6C>236A.

Is it just me, or does F-Kouma's bnb feel easier now when using 236b instead of 236a?

Like, doing 2aa 5b 2b 2c 236b 236b 236[c] 2a 6c j[c] dj[c] land 623a feels a bit more leniant than it did on console for me. However I only rarely alted Kouma so I was just wondering if anybody with more experience with him in console could notice any changes.


The BnB off of rekkas is easier & is a tad bit more lenient but most of the other combos still feel the same.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2012, 12:28:05 PM by Malik »
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Offline BlueBlueAquamarine

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2012, 11:05:55 AM »
Anyone else been looking into C-Kouma? His overall damage went up because 5BB works more often than not in combos.

Here's a BnB that I patched together. It works everywhere
(2a) 2b 5bb 5c 2c 623a j.bc j.bc airthrow/j.236C

I've also been experimenting with 236C 236C command grab combos, but it seems pretty unreliable (as in you just get to hit not the grab). Hitbox data on that grab might be nice...
(2a) 2b 5b 5c 2c 236c 236c

I tried adding 236a and 236b in between, but 236c always ends up whiffing.

Also, after that 236c blows people to corner (which looks awesome), there's gotta be some good oki/tech punish options. The best I could come up with is either 5b for meaty or 6c for covering both sides.
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Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2012, 01:11:18 PM »
Anyone else been looking into C-Kouma? His overall damage went up because 5BB works more often than not in combos.

Here's a BnB that I patched together. It works everywhere
(2a) 2b 5bb 5c 2c 623a j.bc j.bc airthrow/j.236C

I've also been experimenting with 236C 236C command grab combos, but it seems pretty unreliable (as in you just get to hit not the grab). Hitbox data on that grab might be nice...
(2a) 2b 5b 5c 2c 236c 236c

I tried adding 236a and 236b in between, but 236c always ends up whiffing.

Also, after that 236c blows people to corner (which looks awesome), there's gotta be some good oki/tech punish options. The best I could come up with is either 5b for meaty or 6c for covering both sides.

Haven't been experimenting with C-Kouma but I'll be sure.
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Offline KIROV

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #16 on: January 05, 2012, 01:50:44 PM »
Hi all ,   first post in here . Blame Funky-kun :D.
BlueBlueAquamarine i am playing mainly C-Kouma and now i will share my findings.
You suggested using (2a) 2b 5bb 5c 2c 623a j.bc j.bc airthrow/j.236C but as far as my experience goes with c-kouma the most reliable bnb meterless combo is this : (2a/5a) 2b 5b(b) 5c 2c 236a 236c j.bc j.bc 6236b 6236b . The 5bb is a good option but only when the opponent blocked the 2a/5a and 2b as you can easily hold for the charge and mixup  6c or 2c or just jump for j.c+214a.There is a small chance i advise not taking when using the 5bb in the combo that it will not link well.Yes it links better than before but is 200 dmg more worth it ?
Onto the next topic ... :P  I played a little with the game last night and tried some stuff with "6c".Yes its a overhead and if you hit with it there is a big dmg coming up but i tried  other uses for it.This thing OTG relaunches and can be done after 2c after a combo too.There are some options for its use and one of them is free damage after a 2c poke.It goes like this : 2c 6c 236c jbc 6236b 6236b 
I linked a full combo last night too using this but the damage is considerably less than the bnb i wrote about first. It goes like this : (2a/5a) 2b 5b(b) 5c 2c 6c wait a bit 236a 236c jbc jbc 6236b 6236b
It may not do much damage but its PIMP :P Also i do not do airthrows as they happen very high most of the time and is the same with a full bnb with no Oki after it, but i should point that in whichever combo you try you can air throw right after the 236c rekka and is close to the ground and can build up pressure and bait for opponents mistakes.And as you are close to the ground it may open some oki options but i was not working in this direction.
Great changes i saw in this version  are for the use of 22A.This thing manages to poke or anti air a lot of things if timed and spaced  right.It has a good startup and some random hitbox and is open to abuse :P
Why the heck it otg relaunches  i cant comperhend. :\ Oh well no use beating my head over it :D

Talking about pimp stuff i will just put this here : BH(Blood Heat)(2a/5a) 2b 5b(b)5c 2c 6c AAD(while inputing 41236 you have to wait a bit for the opponent to fall at the level of your head and push "C"there)this is a valid combo into AAD and does around 6 k and if there are no 2As or 5A we look at 6.5+ k depending on the character :P
 
« Last Edit: January 05, 2012, 04:00:36 PM by KIROV »
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Offline Benny1

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2012, 09:40:28 PM »
C-Kouma's BNB is 2A 5BB 5C 2C 236A 236B 236C j.CB sdj.BC airthrow.  Does more damage than anything else.
C-Wara main, H-Warc/F-Sion alt.

Offline KIROV

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #18 on: January 06, 2012, 02:03:05 AM »
Hi there,
C-Kouma's BNB is 2A 5BB 5C 2C 236A 236B 236C j.CB sdj.BC airthrow.  Does more damage than anything else.
Thank you  benny1 for showing this!So i tried the combo on C-Sion Tatari and i managed to do it.The Damage was  4819.But as i did it i saw  that the 3 rekkas can be continiued with "jcb sdj.bc"So i tried this too : 2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c 236a 236b 236c jCB sdj.BC 6236b 6236b and this did 5108 damage =3
But these combos are lets just say a bit harder(atleast for me this super double jump is a bit tricky) than all else so i tried other variations just to see the damage results and compare them :
2a 2b 5b 5c 2c 236a 236c j.bc j.bc 6236b 6236b resulted in 4614 damage    -easy
2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c 236a 236b 236c jCB sdj.BC* 6236b 6236b resulted in 5108 damage  -harder*
2A 5BB 5C 2C 236A 236B 236C j.CB sdj.BC* airthrow resulted in 4819 damage   -harder*
2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c 236a 236b 236c j.C  jbc 6236b 6236b resulted in 4935 damage -easy
2a 2b 5b 5c 2c 236a 236b j.bc j.bc 6236b 6236b resulted in 4614 damage -easy

The other thing that made an impression is the after the 3 rekkas the important thing is to continue with j.C.After that you can change your combo a bit to suit you and the dmg will not differ much.The same thing applies to the post rekka combo.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2012, 07:33:23 AM by KIROV »
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Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #19 on: January 06, 2012, 06:31:59 AM »
C-Kouma's BNB is 2A 5BB 5C 2C 236A 236B 236C j.CB sdj.BC airthrow.  Does more damage than anything else.

Pretty much the case, he does have new things & some of his tools have been beefed up but anything outside of an airthrow ender I wouldn't recommended unless the opponent has low life then you do the 623A/B 236A/B for a potential tech punish because most of the time they'll just tech, you'll do some sort of OS (i.e. 2A~2C) to blow it up to lead into another combo & they should be dead by then.
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Offline Benny1

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #20 on: January 06, 2012, 10:13:47 AM »
623B 236B enders should not be done after a super double jump.  You're far too high at that point to get any sort of a tech punish, those enders should only be done from low heights.
C-Wara main, H-Warc/F-Sion alt.

Offline BlueBlueAquamarine

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2012, 12:02:06 PM »
Whoaaa...

When timed well, You can link both 623a and 623b after 2a 5b 2b 2c 22b. This is NOT an invalid combo!

After 623b, you can simply do another 22b to cover back/neutral/no tech. Then, add in another 623b. As for forward tech.... you would have to do some predicting, but if you guess right, you can connect a full BnB anyway.

F-Kouma is now even scarier in corner, lol.
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Offline dumba989

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2012, 11:43:37 PM »
So changes for F-Kouma that aren't listed from the JP list, 2c can IH, and 5A can IH on hit or block as well. Also I'm having timing issues with the 6C into the double BE j.C, someone help please.

Whoaaa...

When timed well, You can link both 623a and 623b after 2a 5b 2b 2c 22b. This is NOT an invalid combo!

After 623b, you can simply do another 22b to cover back/neutral/no tech. Then, add in another 623b. As for forward tech.... you would have to do some predicting, but if you guess right, you can connect a full BnB anyway.

F-Kouma is now even scarier in corner, lol.

Is this character specifc & retype the sequence for the combo correctly to prevent confusion.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2012, 07:18:30 PM by Malik »
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Offline Kamina

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #23 on: January 09, 2012, 11:34:42 AM »
More info on changes for 1.07
I believe I got this about right~

All styles
Air teleports for every style has faster startup

Crescent
623A does more damage, Kouma gets 10% meter instead of 8%, there 13 Frames of blockstun instead of 16 frames and its now jump cancellable

Full Moon
The 236 Rekkas now do more damage and gain more meter
1st rekka Damage went up from 550 - 600, Kouma now gains 7% instead of 3.5% and the B version pushes out further
2nd rekka Damage up 550 - 600, Kouma gains 7% meter instead of 4.5% and the B version pushes out further
3rd rekka (A,B) Damage up 700 - 600, Kouma gains 10% meter instead of 5% and the B version pushes out further
BE rekka ender 236C Damage is now 950 instead of 550 and Kouma now gains 6% meter instead of 3.5%
6C was given 2 more active frames

Half Moon
623A has changed as now it comes out in 23 frames, does 1000+400*2 damage and is +1 on block
6C was given 2 more active frames


Offline BlueBlueAquamarine

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Re: Kishima Kouma current code changes (1.07)
« Reply #24 on: January 12, 2012, 08:48:21 AM »
F-Kouma

Is this character specifc & retype the sequence for the combo correctly to prevent confusion.

5b 2b 2c 22b xx 623b {(tech punish/OTG into 22b ) xx 623b}

You can repeat the part in { }. Haven't tried out on a human opponent yet, but if it does, this would hurt a lot.

How many times can { } be repeated? Well, the most number 623b's I've done is 3, but I am positive that someone with better execution then me can do it more.

22b into 623b is not character specific (even works on lolis and necos). The OTG string afterward is character-specific... Unfortunately, I don't know exactly what OTG string works on each character. Anyone have an OTG string chart for Kouma?

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C-Kouma

I don't know if anyone else tried this out before, but the 5b follow-up after 5b can be charged. When you do that, you pull the opponent back in... In fact, right in the range of 214a! Tick throw anyone?

Possible mixup:
2aa 2b 2c 5b [b ] xx 214a   OR
2aa 2b 2c 5b [b ] 5a
« Last Edit: January 12, 2012, 09:15:35 AM by BlueBlueAquamarine »
The Eternal Noob
Plays only the Manliest Chars: Kouma, Len