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Author Topic: MBAC: Kouma Matchup Thread  (Read 10891 times)

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Offline rashreflection

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MBAC: Kouma Matchup Thread
« on: December 11, 2007, 11:01:13 AM »
Well, with S-Blade taking care of the general stuff, I figured we needed a thread for the more specific problems people may have!

I played Kouma against someone else for the first time last night, and was finding V.Akiha kinda annoying.  With the way her air game works, I can't land 2B almost ever; I've actually had more success fishing for CH j.B, but that can be risky with her hair and all.  It's frustrating being forced to block and get stuck in her offense when she goes airborne...I'm guessing shield is the best answer here?  And when I do shield, I can't get anti-air 5A sometimes - can I get a 2A combo when she lands?

Thanks,
Josh.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2009, 12:31:16 PM by XieXie »

Offline S-Blade

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2007, 03:12:47 PM »
for Akiha and V.Akiha flametongue, it depends where she's doing it. if she's doing it high up in the air, it's best to just dash under and 2b->whatever/improv when she falls. if she's doing it to run away, it's usually best to just let her run away. your game only gets stronger in the corner. if you can anticipate the jump before she flametongues, you can 623b it sometimes since it can be faster than jumping up and 2Bing at farther distances, but if you want to hit her, jumping up for j.b is usually your best bet. now, if she's tigerkneeing it or otherwise doing it close enough for the ground it becomes a lot harder to deal with. your only options would be 1. shield it into 236b (or 623a/b if she's a bit higher), or 2. block. the problem with option 1 is that if you get blocked you're in for a world of hurt. but the one thing i would never ever do against flametongue is poke with a normal. her 2c is too good. even if i ex-shielded the flametongue, i would rather cancel it into 236b (b/c of superarmor).
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Offline Nevan

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2007, 01:43:05 AM »
Aka Akiha is sure a pain in the ass, since Kouma's biggest weak point is the air game its not worth do airbourne, she has double dash and very fast. When i fight against an Aka Akiha i stay on the ground using 22A/B to get out of the corner, then comboing, or trying :p, and corner xD Kouma's very nice for heavy pressure ;)

A nice match is Kouma Vs Nero, god! never used so much shield/ex-shield in a match, its a match where u hav to deal the much dmg possible in a combo, then its dodge, defend and shield. 22B is very very handy against Nero, well at least this is how i do it :P
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Offline Kamina

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2007, 05:02:36 PM »
In the case of Ciel's EX Knives, is it possible to bara super jump 'em, or will I just have to take the hit??

Offline Nevan

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2007, 12:31:29 AM »
Dunno m8...never try that tbh : \  :mystery:
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Offline S-Blade

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2007, 12:30:01 PM »
the easiest way for anyone to beat EX knives is to hold 7 on superflash. You jump backwards. If she's close enough that you dont become airborne and are blocking on the ground, block through everything. But if you are airborne when the knives hit you. stop blocking. The knives hit you, but because you're in the air, you move up with each hit which allows you to air recover and then airdash over her and punish her hard. It works with anyone and is why Ciel players never use EX knives outside of baras.
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Offline Kamina

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2007, 06:43:10 PM »
Hmmm good answer, looks like thats the only option

Offline rashreflection

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2008, 12:17:25 PM »
Thanks a lot guys!

I hate the Ciel matchup btw.  She seems to outprioritize you both on the ground and in the air, and EX Halo makes your EX Dunk and 22C practically useless.  I know her various mixups and how I'm supposed to block them, but it's still an uphill battle.

I probably need to bara consistently, that much I'm sure of - yes it's 150% meter, but he doesn't have a whole lot of other uses for it in this matchup.  Also supposedly she is vulnerable to bara throw at certain points, which would be awesome with my A command grab, but I can't figure out just when that is...

Any help would be appreciated! =)

-Josh

Offline Kamina

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2008, 04:24:02 PM »
Well during her combo, her curry uppercut, 2B, and curry knife 4C, are barable just wait till that last hit off the knife or uppercut and you caught her!, I know.... I like putting curry in her moves.....lol

Offline ennvi

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2008, 04:33:54 PM »
Any tips against Ren? I can't seem to do crap against her T_T
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Offline S-Blade

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2008, 09:59:14 PM »
i hate that fucking cat

seriously, like nothing works since half of his shit is best on ground and she's always airborne. 2b is at least worth a shot because hey you might trade but there's a big chance you won't. i would say just DP her but not recklessly, take the one DP opportunity you get to turn into a tech trap and get good damage in. don't guess EX dunk nearly as much, try going for 623C instead; there are a lot of times that it's a free 3.5k on her. you can also try shield/ex-shielding into dp.

if anyone finds any REAL tips for beating a good len please post them somewhere here lol
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Offline Asuzagi

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2008, 08:32:57 PM »
I only really have tips for White Len,
It's best to get away from her, and let her come to you. You can string up a better combo and more damage with very little interference. Also, when she uses her shard on you, do a quick grab, doesn't matter which, because you'd be invincible while grabbing her, making it so the shard won't hit you.
I imagine the closest the American comic writers have ever gotten to Kouma would be the Incredible Hulk. Except Kouma isn't a gay green color.

Offline AntiJDS

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2008, 04:19:56 PM »
if anyone finds any REAL tips for beating a good len please post them somewhere here lol
Whenever she sarts approaching from the air use 22A, B, Or C "GTFO Me biatch" Attacks.
Once that is done try 236 B or C When she's hitstunned.

And if she send out cats, 236A, B, or C Over them instead of jumping.

Maybe these'll help :slowpoke:

Offline Xie

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #13 on: March 08, 2008, 12:18:11 PM »
Eh, so, everyone is talking about matchups lately, so I thought I'd do the same. These are taken from what I've experienced as a Kouma who rushes headlong too much into everything, so viewer discretion is advised. If you combine this with S-blade and the pro's opinons, you should get a pretty good idea of what to expect.

I'll be writing up stuff about why I think each matchup is where, if you have any questions about something I didn't cover, just ask in this thread or on mIRC.

Edit: I put up placeholders because I started going in random order due to whatever matchups I've played that day.

Overall (In order):
Advantaged:
Arc
Sion

Slightly Advantaged:
Warakia
Kohaku
Hisui&Kohaku

Relatively Even:
Aoko
Shiki Nanaya
Akiha Vermillion
White Len
Kouma
Satsuki
M. Hisui
Akiha Tohno
Miyako

Slightly Disadvantaged:
V. Sion
Hisui
Tohno Shiki
Warc
Ren

Disadvantaged:
Ciel
Chaos

Matchup specifics from worst to best. It won't be finished for a bit since I probably have to actually play the matchup to get it fresh in my mind, I'll get back to it later though.
 
Chaos: Disadvantaged

General: This is one of Kouma's worst matchups because it is easily his most unsafe matchup. First off, Chaos' normals are very long reaching, so if Chaos is outside your maximum range he can freely combo you while avoiding damage. While this wouldn't be a problem in it of itself, your normals don't strictly beat his normals either, so it is very difficult to damage Chaos if you don't have the momentum of the match on your favor since your normals only win if they are far enough ahead. Add projectiles into the mix, and your approach and your ability to turn around a defensive situation all have a lot of accompanying risk if you guess wrong.

Advantages:
+Damage per combo is in your favor
+Chaos does not have strong options against your wakeup control
+Chaos has many bara 214a/c able chains

Disadvantages:
-Difficult to approach
-Can be zoned out
-Air inferiority
-Block once and you're outside of reach

Other random info:
!Grabbing gives you invulnerability, so you can use this to beat some projectile punishes (I.E: EX Crows, Slow Snake)
!Maximum ranged 623a/b hits him while he's standing, but hits low
!22c is pretty bad against him due to his reach and throw reach and multihit moves
!Baraing Chaos normals other than 4C is risky because chaos can cancel his other ones, so if you were expecting to bara on the 3rd hit of 2b or something and he cancels it, you'll get a shield bunker which might lose to whatever else he throws out after

tl;dr: DAMN YOUR LONG RANGE AND YOUR DAMN ANIMALS

Ciel: Disadvantaged

General: Another not so fun matchup. Overall, offensively and defensively, most of Ciel's moves flat out beat yours, even if you started your moves first. She just does a lot of things that you can do, but better and more safely. What's worse is that Ciel can randomly throw out EX Hiero and have it beat something you are doing. Her blockstrings are very long and difficult to punish without doing something risky like guess shielding. She can zone with swords, though they are only particularly effective if you are unable to jump out of them. All in all, to win this matchup, you have to play well: the offensive momentum needs to swing heavily in your favor and avoid making punishable mistakes.

Advantages:
-Amusingly, Kouma has no non-gimicky real advantages in this matchup. He and Ciel are fairly even at a lot of things, but Ciel has some advantages over him.

Disadvantges:
-EX Hiero punishes MANY of your blockstring enders and MANY of your stagger strings   
-Ciel has rediculously high priority and (applicable) clash frames against you
-Nearly endless blockstrings, risky to reversal/poke out

Other Random Info
!2b whiffs under ciel if she's dashing toward you. If you're expecting throw, 2aaaa is the way to go, as long as you're expecting to either hit or clash.
!Do no activate 22c or heat unless you are certain you will hit or your opponent has no meter, EX Hiero is pain (albiet if they Hiero too early, you get a free combo if you survive)
!For once, the air to air matchup isn't completely lopsided: you have a chance to win an air to air encounter
!Difficult to bara 214a against, except for the second hit of 4c

tl;dr: EVERYTHING YOU DO IS BETTER THAN MINE

Len: Slightly Disadvantaged

General: This match is entirely hinged upon your air defense. Len utterly destroys you in the air and she's got really strong air to ground moves that are all relatively safe, so your ability to
beat her air rushdown is basically the whole matchup. If you can pluck her out of the sky, you're in a pretty strong position because Len doesn't have a particularly strong ground game. There are a lot of minor annoyances when dealing with Len, but if you can get used to this matchup it's not significantly detrimental to your game.

Advantages
+Kouma's Superior ground game
+Len does not have strong options against your wakeup control

Disadvantages
-Kouma's Inferior air game
-Len's strong air to ground game
-Difficult to overturn momentum

Random tips on beating Len's air game
!You can air throw or 5a Len out of her IAD crossup if you can react to it in time
!Len's Jump C is not significantly difficult shield timing. Learn that 5a shield combo
!If you are above Len, you can throw out your own j C and it will be relatively safe from this position
!You can dash/backdash/22b out of Len's air to ground if you're not in the corner, if your opponent threw out a j 2c, it's possible to punish it
!If you wish to do a reversal 623c, wait until your frames are about to touch or you can clearly see your opponent performing an attack. Otherwise Len will just dash over you.
!623 a/b lose outright to most of Len's moves, but, if you do it unpredictablely as they begin their jump string (as in, before they start hammering the c button), you can score a hit

Other random info:
!Damage output in this matchup is about even
!BE CAREFUL WHEN USING AIR BASED OKI AGAINST LEN IN THE CORNER, if you get thrown, you're going to eat a fucking huge combo if she has any meter at all
!2aaaaaaaaa on wakeup is viable against Len if you're not expecting heat or super twirl
!2b will whiff at some ranges on crouching len, so use with caution
!Len's 5C is EXTREMELY easy to bara 214a on the last hit
!The best time to reversal poke is to guess when Len is going for a dashup throw, other than that it's better to just keep blocking
!Len's tech punishes aren't as mean as Hisui's, but the only time you really should tech after a corner air throw if you clearly see Len dashing up for the invalid combo

tl;dr FUCKING CAT, STAY ON THE GROUND.

Warc: Slightly Disadvantaged

General: Warc is a matchup that can be overwhelming if you do not know how to shield or reversal too well. On offense, after a bloodring at the end of any of her ground blockstrings often gives her enough spacing and frame advantage to continue her rushdown, making any attempt to reverse the situation impossible if the bloodring either pushed her too far or gave her enough advantage to jump/dash up again. Furthermore, her air to ground normals in combination with air bloodrings can completely dominate any non-ex or non-shield AA attempt and she can seamlessly go from air blockstring to ground blockstring, so there's no real chance to make a turnaround here either. Thus, the only real window of opportunity to make a turnaround is right at her initial attack, which usually involves you shielding and/or EXing your way out or telegraphing your opponent's attack and managing to hit them before they even begin their attack. But be careful, all of these methods can be very risky though if your opponent is able to bait it. On defense Warc has nothing TOO special, but she does have a lot of options to defend herself in the form of EXs, teleports, dashes, stagger string breakers that will test how good your offense is.

Advantages:
+Damage per combo is in your favor
+Ground normal exchanges are slightly in your favor

Disadvantages:
-Bloodrings allow Warc to control the flow of the match
-Complete air to air and air to ground superiority outside of shielding or extremely early attacks

Other random info:
!If you can react in time, you can beat her EX teleport by using 22b/c. Held shield 214a is fine too
!Blood waterfall on wakeup can be randomly good against you if you choose to use an oki that uses  j. C, it can clash and beat you randomly
!Be careful of what you shield. There are a lot of things you COULD shield (ground bloodring, bloodwall), but they potentially lead to no advantage whatsoever (or even disadvantage, in many cases)
!Though I made it sound like Warc has a gapless rushdown, she does have her charged overhead. (Held) shield into 214a or mashing an EX can beat this quite cleanly.

TL;DR ALL THIS RED SHIT IS REALLY ANNOYING.

Shiki Tohno: Slightly Disadvantaged

General Info: This is a very linear matchup, there's not particularly special about Tohno except that he just is able to rush that shit down against you with his high speed and long normals. His blockstrings are very long and difficult to punish due to his movement speed and 623a as a blockstring ender. In the air, j A. cannonball or j. C can just about shut down any normals you throw out and his air to ground strings can't be beaten by AA attempts that don't have a shield or an EX involved. On the ground, his speed is really fast and his super 2C sweep can break your stagger chains and has really long range. Also, Tohno has a lot of options to avoid your oki if not in the corner with his invincible dp,superfast movement, and all the other normal options (heat, shield, blocking, etc). Overall, this matchup is a skill tester in how good your offense and defense are.

Advantages:
-Kouma has an edge in average damage per combo

Disadvantages:
-Tohno's reach is longer than your own in the air and on the ground
-Tohno's normals win in almost any situation where you aren't ahead in throwing them out

Other random info:
!Go for the shield if the see the charged 5[C]
!All of Tohno's EX's are unsafe, so

Hisui: Slightly Disadvantaged

General: Another very straightforward matchup where Kouma is slightly edged out in a few departments without making up for it signficantly. Like most other matchups, you can't easily win air to air or ground to air without using something with shields or EXs. However, in this matchup, you can't win ground to ground either because Hisui has nearly as much priority and clash frames as Ciel. So basically, if you're not on offense, Hisui can beat you out in almost any situation using the right normal. However, once you're on offense, the situation can completely reverse itself because Hisui doesn't have many tools to beat your j.B or j.C (IAD or otherwise), so once you rush down, make sure you rush down properly and keep Hisui from getting back on offense.

Advantages
+Hisui doesn't have many options on wakeup

Disadvantages
-Hisui beats you in the air
-Hisui beats you on the ground

Other random info:
!Using 22c to counter bento can lead to some great results... or get you thrown. Use your best judgment.
!Dodging her 5C is risky, but can be rewarding because it would otherwise be completely safe against you, shielding it is futile
!If she crosses you up with her j. 2C, your 2a IS NOT FAST ENOUGH to beat her 2a if you both mash
!Hisui is a tech punishing fiend, and Kouma is no exception, be very, very careful when you tech anywhere
!Hisui's 214b can actually pretty good at keeping you away, make sure you don't try to double jump dash over it, because you might eat a high vase

V. Sion: Slightly Disadvantaged

General: While this match is similar to the Sion matchup (since they have almost the same normals), it is not nearly as linear because V. Sion has a couple of really, really important options that regular Sion doesn't have that make this matchup somewhat into her favor due to her much, much more varied rushdown tactics. As opposed to Sion who can only use j. C feasibly to air to ground rushdown, V. Sion also has her divekick which you can't anti-air easily without being particularly risky; it can be blocked low, but the blockstun makes it hard for you to do anything about it. V. Sion's ground rushdown isn't more powerful from a logistic point of view (warning shot vs a/b/c katto as a blockstring ender), but V.Sion deals more damage via her throws which can put pressure on you when having to guess between block/poke/shield on defense. Lastly, V. Sion has the Akiha summon to control your wakeup, and unfortunately the Akiha summon is very good at limiting what you can do on wakeup because of its weird pushback properties and it's unpredictable attack timing combined with V.Sion's attack priority.

Advantages:
+V. Sion doesn't have many options on wakeup against you (Her wakeup EX's are very, very easy for Kouma's oki to beat)

Disadvantages:
-V. Sion's wakeup control is very strong against you
-V. Sion's priority edges you out slightly in a few situations

Other random info:
!You can punish her katto blockstring ender with 214C if your timing is good
!You can throw out 214C against Akiha summon oki if you're feeling lucky guessing ground based attack, but be careful
!Be careful when heating against V. Sion, her AD can grab you out of it
!You can block divekick low
!Like Sion, you can beat 6B overhead with 2a/b from certain ranges and at certain intervals

Miyako Arima: Relatively Even

General: Miyako is a pretty fair matchup for the most part; Kouma and Miyako are both close range fighters who have fairly decent damage output. However, Miyako is definitely one of your worst air to air matchups in the whole game. Not only does she totally beat you out with her normals or her air throw, you can end up eating around ~3k worth of damage pretty easily off of an air to air only combo. Stay the hell out of the air unless you're prepared to guess correctly and don't mind taking the risk involved. Miyako doesn't have a lot of range, so on the ground, Kouma has some leverage due to his reach/clash frames/bara 214a, but if she gets too close to you too quickly, Miyako's normals are really powerful against you, so its often better to end blockstrings at a length where she can't easily counterpoke you. Her ground pressure isn't overly overwhelming either,since either Kouma will have better options at the length the blockstring will put you at, or you can dunk/bunker/bara your way through most of her normal blockstring enders (22a, for the most part). On wakeup Miyako isn't that powerful since she lacks good options (her wakeup DP is about as bad as yours), but her smaller hitbox can make some oki setups that require a J. C a little harder to land.

Advantages:
+Kouma's long range
+Miyako's lack of wakeup options

Disadvantages:
-Kouma loses greatly in terms air priority
-Kouma has less priority on the ground

Other Random Info:
!Miyako's AD is air unblockable and unshieldable(?), so if she's Maxed out or in Heat, you might want to be careful if you use an air based oki
!You can clash through the entirety Miyako's 623c, it's tricky and not really worth it, but don't be surprised if it randomly happens
!Miyako's air throw sets up a tech punish in a corner, but you can tech forward if you notice that your opponent is dashing up for the invalid otg string; but don't tech otherwise
!Baraing Miyako's 22a is very tricky
!Miyako's dodge can cross you up

Akiha Tohno: Relatively Even

General: DOU? Akiha Tohno is a very solid character with no real weakness or strengths. She's got good mixups, mobility, defense, priority, damage output, and pressure; but she's not overwhelming you in any of these categories either, so this matchup can come up to playskill pretty often. In an air to air fight, if you're below her she has the upper hand, but if you're above you can edge her out with your j. C, or if she switches to jump C, you can win by being below her. On air to ground defense, shielding (only) an air flametounge is not safe because you'll eat a combo (unless you correctly guess high low and shield AGAIN) but either way you're open for a throw so you'll pretty much stuck blocking and waiting for a reversal chance. She doesn't have a lot of bara-able strings other than her ground based flametounges, but and guess baraing isn't recommended since Akiha's normals can be staggered pretty far apart. Kouma can break out of T. Akiha's pressure with his EX's and Akiha can break out of yours (via her EX Flametounge wakeup and decent dash speeds), so there's no direct possibility of a very lopsided match.

Advantages/Disadvantages: This is about as far as a matchup could be in melty, though it may seem lopsided if you can't block correctly against flametounge/Akiha instant overhead

Other Random Info:
!Akiha's instant overhead is actaully slightly slower than her 2b, this is actually the key to being able to predict whether or not it's going to be high or low. If you want to be a luck sack, you can go ahead and aaaaaa your way out of either one because if she waited for you to get up before using either block string, you might be able to break it
!You can 22b to try and get out of corner AD, Kouma's 22b causes his hitbox to disappear, which nullifies the grab part, and the superarmor lets you get through the other hits relatively unscatched, you have to telegraph this though, which is risky
!When faced with corner flamepit setups, you can EX dunk you way through any ground string
!You can 5b if you suspect T. Akiha is going to use her ground flame pillar, it will beat it cleanly if you start it quickly enough (and you're in range)

Mech Hisui: Relatively Even

General: This is a matchup where you have to play very well to win, but there are two routes to victory here. Mech Hisui has a lot of projectiles, so you'll be dealing with them a lot in order to break into her zone (more on that later). On the ground, her 2b can demolish anything you do unless you're very far ahead due to it's clash frames and priority, so keep that in mind. On the flipside of that, because of the clash involved, if you are good at causing the 2b to clash with your dash, you can very easily break through her defenses, so keep that in mind when you're ending your block strings and beginning your next dash. Air approaches are very risky, you've got to shield through jetpacks because blocking them will get you nowhere (and probably air thrown), but can be rewarding. If you can corner Mech Hisui, avoid getting hit by her Barrier/heat and keep her 2b locked away and you'll be able to deal a ton of damage to her because she doesn't have a lot of ways to get out of a situation like that. On another note, if you can bara her 2b (VERY HARD TO DO) and 5c (not as hard to do), you've basically neutered her entire block string because if she's forced to whiff cancel those moves, it's much harder for her to keep her pressure up at close range. With that in mind, sometimes it's actually better to force Mech Hisui to come to you, instead of chasing her down to try and get the knockdown. If you're patient, you may be able to score a corner knockdown that seals the game.

Dealing with Projectiles:
Shotgun: This comes out fast and isn't very punishable at most heights, you can dash to try and clash (risky), but it's usually better just to shield/block and continue your approach normally. On block or shield, you gain a slight bit of mometum.
EX Shotgun: similar to normal shotgun, but it's homing and unprediable (so don't try to clash it), it's better to shield or block this as well, though you probably won't gain any mometum in your approach
Eye Beams: All of these you can dash or crouch under. But be aware that if you your dash is poorly timed, you'll take this to the face
Jetpacks: Shield these, don't bother contesting with them unless you're ready to do that
Missles: These aren't bad, you can shield or air block them, or dash under if it's only the single missle
Flamethrower(sorta): isn't really a projectile per se, but notably if this whiffs you you can punish it by dashing in and beating on her

EX Bomb: On EX bomb on your wakeup, pay attention to your opponent's distance and movements very carefully. React accordingly if they are going for:
A throw: Jump or double jump out, double jumping can help you dodge the air throw too
Low attack: Block
High Attack: Block

It is more likely that your opponent will go for a throw in situations where the bomb is just <about> to hit, because then they can land it and deal 3k to you from the bomb damage, if the bomb hits you, their throw will whiff due to the hitblock/stun, so always measure that distance carefully.

Advantages:
+Kouma has strong options vs Mech Hisui's wakeup game
+Kouma can play strong while playing defensively against Mech Hisui

Disadvantages:
-Mech Hisui can outzone Kouma with her projectiles
-Air approaches against Mech Hisui are risky

Other Random Info:
!If M Hisui is approaching you with tk jetpacks and you've got meter to spare, punch her with 236c every once and awhile; it's got great range and is fast enough to punish tk jetpack at some ranges.
!If you are beastly enough to bara Mech Hisui's 2b, DO IT
!Watch out for M hisui's B whip, it's unblockable.

Satsuki: Relatively Even

General: This match is pretty gimmicky on both sides. Satsuki has better overall air priority while Kouma has better overall ground priority, so it really just depends on who gets the first knock down. Satsuki's her 4-way mixup can lead to really big damage chains if she gets the first knockdown; it's not particularly safe to use any of your EX reversals because her 4-way mixup has ways to bait and beat all of them. On the flipside, Satsuki doesn't have a lot of options against you if you get a knockdown because her reversal and movement options aren't overwhelmingly powerful either. One thing to keep in mind is that Satsuki has some of the best aaaaaa in the game, so be careful if you're planning a raw grab or even a tick throw.

Advantages:
+Kouma's better ground priority
+Kouma's mobility

Disadvantages:
-Satsuki's stronger air priority
-Satsuki's mashout aaaaaa

Other Random Info:
!Satsuki has one air attack syndrome like Kouma, so you can actually try to use 236a/b to anti air, her air attack will hit your super armor, attack continues and hits her; risky though
!22c is the best wakeup option against Satsuki's 4-way mixup... the only thing is that it's baited the same way that a Satsuki would bait a wakeup heat, but it's slightly safer (if she double jumps, to avoid it, her jump C won't allow her to combo you) and slightly cheaper in most cases.

Kouma: SEVERELY DISADVANTAGED

General: THIS MATCHUP IS REALLY HARD AND THE ONLY WAY TO WIN IT IS TO ABUSE GIMMICKS.

Advantages:
NONE

Disadvantages:
EVERYTHING

Other random info:
!When trading hits, whoever started and finished first is the winner.
!Kouma's Oki is both bad and great against himself, while Kouma has decent options on wakeup, your opponent knows exactly when and how to bait them
!Amusingly, 22c beats out special command grabs, but not normal grabs, this might be the only matchup where you use your normal throw outside of the corner
!Dunk beats itself, 623c beats itself, as with most moves with invulnerability, whoever goes second wins. Not necessarily the case for AD though.

White Len: Relatively Even

General: Ah yes, White Len. This will be a matchup you won't come across a whole lot, but this matchup is basically a measure of how good you are at defending yourself. Kouma's a lot better than White Len at a lot of things (damage, priority, pressure and even speed in some castegories), but White Len's mixups are quite varied and pretty strong. Meanwhile, Kouma doesn't have a godly mobility or godly priority, so it's pretty much down to your defensive capabilities to turn win the day. Note that I said defensive abilities and not neccessarily blocking, because if you're a great guesser but a shitty blocker you can still beat White Len if you use the right reversal often because you will out damage White Len in most situations despite her high defense. On wakeup, White Len has a decent wakeup options (her dashes and her DP in addition to the standard assortment other characters get), so take care to vary your oki and not eat a DP every time. On the ground, in addition to ice traps, her 2b is nearly unbeatable (though punishable on whiff). In the air, you may or may not win in a normal trade situation (your j. B and j.C might beat her normals), but she can spam ice and her held j. C get you counterhit if you're reckless.

Advantages:
+Logistically, Kouma has the advantage in every areas except in air to air combat, however

Disadvantages:
-White Len has strong mixups which can make it hard to escape pressure and actually apply Kouma's better stats

Other Random Info:
!Against White Len's spindance, you have a lot of options to defend yourself, you can either dunk it most of the time
!Shielding and baraing are risky against White Len unless your reads are very sick. Even AA shielding can be hard because the timing is different from most other characters
!DO NOT SHIELD WHITE LEN'S HELD ICE SHARD. That's just asking for it.
!White Len's command grab can grab you out of nearly anything
!You can actually beat out White Len's ground to air ice pretty easily, j. C can clobber her before it comes out or can even clash through it

Akiha Vermilion: Relatively Even

General: This matchup plays a lot like Akiha Tohno logistically; you've got to deal with a lot of the same things as with the Akiha Tohno matchup: air ribbons, flamepit traps, air counterhits, half decent reversal options, the works. The only major difference is the type of mixups and spacing you'll have to be doing. For one, Akiha Vermillion is much more aerodynamic with her double air dash and movement speed, which gives her different options in her rush down; she has a lot of options for aerial blockstrings and confusing movement. It's much harder for you to shield and reversal correctly against her in a vacuum against her air to ground rushdown, but on the flipside of her ground to ground isn't as powerful as powerful as T. Akiha. She has really, really low defense but to offset that she can also dish out a ton of damage, so it can really go either way. This can be a matchup where you use more risky tactics to turn around the situation, because if you guess right a few times, the high rewards you might reap from your high risks might be worth it.

Advantages:
+Kouma can kill V. Akiha in 3 or so comboes

Disadvantages:
-V. Akiha has a strong aerial rushdown

Other Random Info:
!Kouma's corner combo deals retarded amounts of damage to V. Akiha, if you run one of these out, you're already halfway to victory
!Kouma's 22c isnt' very good against V. Akiha before a knockdown, she can run away very easily if you activate on a whim
!2b or 5aaaaaaaa can be used to catch V. Akiha when she's using her double air dash to confuse you, both have a level of unsafety, though

Shiki Nanaya: Relatively Even

General: Nanaya is a very even matchup. You don't outmatch each other in particularly strong ways. You need to be fairly away of his frame traps and watch out for his a attacks. Don't be reckless and leave large frame gaps because Nanaya can tear through them with his 2a. Don't throw out j. C unless you've got a good amount of time to start it up either or his 5a will demolish you. Anti to air combat is very risky bcause of Nanaya's j. a canonball too. However, if you stay on the ground, Nanaya's mixups are fairly linear and are not too tough to block or mash 2b out of.  This throws don't hurt too much either, so you can take a few of them and still end up winning. Pay attention to how far away Nanaya is from you and whether or not he can land his 2b/c from the distance he is at from you. If he can't, then he needs to whiff and dash to continue pressure. A big helper in this matchup is that you can beat out his whiffed 5a/2a or a dashup by using 2/5b if you can react in time to it, but you'll lose if he guesses to throw out a faster normal or ended up not dashing, which is why it's important to constantly guage the distance. His dp is good on wakeup, but it's very, very punishable if it blocks or whiffs; it's more his backdash on wakeup that you need to worry about punishing.

Advantages:
+Kouma outdamages Nanaya

Disadvantages:
-Nanaya is faster than Kouma

Other Random Info:
!Nanaya's 214b punishes full screen heats
!Anti airing Nanaya can be troublesome, his j. B is anoying to shield because it's quick and two hits
!While 5/2b is much safer and more rewarding when punishing a Nanaya fowarad dash, sometimes it's better to dunk out of Nanaya frame traps if you're afraid of guessing wrong.

Aoko: Relatively Even

General Info: Aoko is an anoying matchup, if you don't have any experience in this matchup, this matchup becomes exponentially harder because your victory essentially comes from being able to defend yourself from Aoko's attack patterns and frame gaps. Fortuntionatly, every single one of Aoko strings and rushdown patterns is not completely air tight in terms of recovery or safety (though it might seem so if you haven't played the matchup enough), so your ability to read your opponent's offense is crucial. One important thing is to know the types of setups your opponent will try to do while certain orbs are on the screen and the tricks that come with them (for example, the midscreen heel drop overhead in combination with the above your head orb), so you know whether to shield/poke/block. Try not to be too hasty with reversals or heats, because is a character with a lot of wiggle room in terms of baiting and punishing that type of stuff.

Hisui & Kohaku: slightly Advantaged

General Info: This matchup is basically identical to the Kohaku matchup, since most people use Kohaku as lead (since Hisui lead is basically strictly worse than having solo Hisui and the assists you get are close to useless). I'm not going to say much on it because of that, but the only major differences are that Kohaku now has very good blockstring enders and some extra mixups and can deal significant amounts of damage if you get hit by one of the Hisui assists, but... if you know what all the assists are then you have foothold on what extra other things can occur in the matchup. One easy way to think about this is to treat the assists as a projectile (well, Kohaku assist are basically all projectiles, but that's another story). Also, the maids take extra damage, so Kohaku has even less life which can actaully make a pretty significant difference when you're going for a corner combo or a wallslam combo due to how the extra damage modifier works and Kouma's low number of hits.

Other Random Info:
!Remember, maid assists can soak up hits, so think abotu that before attempting to poke out; not that you'd want to poke out of most projectiles only, right?
!But on another assist note, assists (as far as I know) are throw invincible, so you can dunk through them, though I wouldn't try ADing through them because you will probably trade

Kohaku: Slightly Advantaged

General: This is a good matchup in many ways. For once, Kohaku takes damage like a bitch and doesn't dish a whole lot of it per combo, so mathmatically, Kouma's beatdown causes some pretty big trouble for her, meaning you have to guess right only a few times and you have more chances to guess wrong. Kohaku also doesn't have many options on wakeup either, so if she gets knocked down by you, well, your opponent doesn't have very many options to dig her way out. However, the matchup still presents some difficultly because Kohaku has good reach and can beat you out when you're trying to trade normals. Furthermore, Kohaku's mixups are really deep and can be tough to predict, so things can get pretty hectic if you get knocked down by her. Luckily, her oki relies on using plants, which if she goes for any type of low mixup (as in, she's on the ground), you can bara and grab her using the plant's hitstop. You could just straight up throw out a 214C or 623C on wakeup, but its' a little riskier, albiet a bit more rewarding as well. This still requires you to guess correctly between high and low, but it does mean you get an easier reversal of what would normally turn back into a neutral state (or slightly disadvantaged state) after guessing correctly.

Advantages:
+Kouma beats the crap out of her Damage and Defense wise
+Kouma beats the crap out of her with his oki and wakeup control
+Kouma can break through Kohaku's oki easier than some other characters

Disadvantages:
-Kohaku's reach can be tough to get through
-Kohaku's oki is still pretty decent on top of that

Other random info:
!Kohaku's 5b is really anoying when you're trying to make an air to ground approach, shield it or go for the j. C clash
!Kohaku's 5c is pretty damn unsafe, if she whiffs one, beat the hell out of her
!If you are baraing against Kohaku, remembe that you can actually grab her by the broom, making it possible to bara 214a in many situations
!Ex Dunk beats Ex batou if they are simultaneous, useless info, but cool

Warakia: Slightly Advantaged

General: Warakia is a matchup you have the advantage in due to the fact that you can outdamge him easily and have a broad variety of ways to escape his pressure. On defense, you can dunk your way through many of his frame gaps and bara many of his big hitbox normals; this holds true against Chaos mixup as well. You combine that with the fact that you can usually beat out Warakia's normals in the air and on the ground, you can really put the hurting on him in many situations. His hitbox is also really big even out of their active frames, so expect to randomly clobber and grab him by the cape quite often for really big damage. He has decent reversals varied reversals (up katto, forward katto, AD, katto tornado, teleports, dashing) that work in a variety of situations, so sometimes your standard dashup after a knockdown is more advantageous. This is because the only reversal he can use to beat the dashup are unsafe if you choose to not meaty. However, outside of that, Warakia has good range and speed, so if you're not able to get close to him, you can often get zoned out by his superior reach and speed.

Advantages:
+Kouma's Superior damage/defense
+Kouma's defensive tactics and reversals

Disadvantages:
-Warakia can out zone you with your speed and reach

Other Random Info:
!The first combo is the most important; Warakia's defense is the worst for his first 25% (taking 108% damage for that area); but substantially gets better after.
!Throw out 5b if you see Warakia whiff cancel within range; it beats dashes and will clash with some of his normals on the ground, and may recover fast enough to beat IAD
!Against Chaos summon oki, blocking is pretty much the best way to go; you can EX Dunk or Kick your way out, but it's only recommend if you know your opponent is doing an early or super late dash up
!Baraing is against Warakia is easy... sort of. He has a lot of big hitboxed multihitting moves, but the problem is that he often whiff cancels these moves, so you might end up with a bunker as the last hit you're expecting doesn't come up
!In an air to ground situation, Warakia might throw out 2b to anti air; sometimes you'll win, sometimes you won't. It depends if you were super late (getting the clash) or super early (varying priority between the two)

Sion: Advantaged

General: The advantage that comes from this matchup is basically due to how braindead simple this matchup is. While Sion's rushdown patterns are very strong and fast, they are very simple to predict and take apart for Kouma. Air to air, her only good air normal is j C, and you can actually stand a chance by throwing out j.C against her j. C and clashing through it for the hit. Air to ground, you've got both j. A and j. C to shield, so if you can get the timing down and avoiding traps, you can break this pattern too. Lastly, on the ground, which is Sion's best playfield, is fairly simple for Kouma as well. This is mainly because on the ground, Sion is basically just setting up her 6B overhead or throw because her attacks are all low aside from that. While this would be perplexing against most characters, Kouma's options are really simple in this matchup, his 2a/b can beat 6B (or dashup throw, if you're really brave) on reaction which can be a really devastating turnaround since it means a full BnB for you.

Advantages:
+Kouma defends against Sion very easily
+Sion cannot break Kouma's oki very easily because her dashes aren't that good and she only has DP/heat/block.

Disadvantages:
-Kouma has no clear disadvantages in this matchup

Other random info:
!Kouma's j. C can beat her 623b on wakeup via clash and just priority, though, if you're using crossup oki, your opponent is more likely to not want to do it, because he might cross himself up into a 421b which you can punish

Arcrueid: Advantaged

General info: Poor Arc, this really is a really terrible matchup for her. Kouma's 2b can beat her out of ALL her air to ground approaches unless they were thrown out way early, and if that's the case, Kouma can easily shield and punish her. Kouma's ground game is also stronger, with 5b and 2b out-reaching or out-prioritizing most of her normals as well. On top of that, Arc's game plan is just as linear as Sion's but without the speed and her overhead is even slower and easier to break (shield into 214a beats her charged overhead every time, even if she decides not to charge it all the way), so there are not very many safe ways for Arc to get through your defense and deal damage to you. Her options on wakeup aren't that great either despite having a DP, it's easy to bait hers because the arc on it isn't very good against people who are going for any sort of crossup oki.

Advantages:
+Kouma can very, very easily defend himself against Arc's rushdown options
+Kouma can control Arc's wakeup fairly well

Disadvantages:
-Kouma has no clear disadvantages in this matchup

Other random info:
!Arc has a fuzzy guard setup that does hit Kouma, but it's not easy to setup, so if you've seen it before then you should be able to tell what's coming.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2008, 08:06:55 AM by XieXie »
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Offline abitofBaileys

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #14 on: March 08, 2008, 12:54:32 PM »
That's a nice matchup guide. Will help me a lot. +heat.

Offline S-Blade

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2008, 11:11:59 AM »
Nice Xie. I don't want to necessarily argue with you because I'm not 100% right on anything and you seem to be a good source of feedback of where I might be doing wrong, but I think there are a few general concepts that you should remember to take into account.

Kouma's offensive matchup-wise is dependent on how risky his options are during oki against a certain character. Characters with DPs and good wakeup EXes aren't good for him.

Kouma's midscreen/situation reset game matchup-wise is dependent mostly upon priority of his moves over theirs, because you want to score that first knockdown to get things going.

Kouma's defensive matchup-wise (or anyone really) is dependent on how easily he can use reversals and bara to go from defensive to a great offensive going straight into grab-wallslam combos.

I think if you cover each of these three parts with each character (which i have NOT done in my thread btw), you'll have covered everything necessary to make a great, solid and faultless judgement on the overall matchup.
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Offline Sphyra

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2008, 05:39:54 PM »
Was skimming through the thread today at work and I saw a line I thought was a little funny and felt the need to comment on. Might even be helpful too.

!Hisui is a tech punishing fiend, and Kouma is no exception, be very, very careful when you tech anywhere

He is in fact an exception. When Hisui does her j.BB setup, the usual 5A 2C punish won't work on a Kouma who doesn't tech (at best the 2C will OTG). What this mean is if Kouma doesn't tech, Hisui can't do a relaunch, and if 2C hits as OTG the following bento won't be safe.

This is a pretty big headache for me when fighting against Kouma. I'm glad I don't see too many of them. None, actually.
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Offline Xie

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Re: Kouma Matchup Thread
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2008, 01:59:40 PM »
Quote
He is in fact an exception. When Hisui does her j.BB setup, the usual 5A 2C punish won't work on a Kouma who doesn't tech (at best the 2C will OTG). What this mean is if Kouma doesn't tech, Hisui can't do a relaunch, and if 2C hits as OTG the following bento won't be safe.

This is a pretty big headache for me when fighting against Kouma. I'm glad I don't see too many of them. None, actually.

Weird, I didn't know that Hisui couldn't relaunch him, since usually my Hisui opponents will just do a 2c into chair/bento on my no-tech. Either way, I basically just put that info as "don't motherfucking tech stupidily or you will die," which still stands true even at this sort of exception. Thanks for the tip.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2008, 02:01:11 PM by XieXie »
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