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Author Topic: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis  (Read 21993 times)

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Offline c-nero 5[c]

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"Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« on: March 01, 2008, 06:46:06 AM »
Okay I've seen a lot of people fucking bitching all day that they're getting destroyed by people online and originally I'd planned a big fancy formatted guide to playing melty/fighting games in general but to be perfectly honest it's pretty fucking simple and I can probably cover the majority of issues in a paragraph or two so let's do that.



First of all, Melty is a very offense-based game, because an opponent rushing someone down has an absolute shitload of tools to make you block wrong, poke when you shouldn't, or eat a throw. Some of these are very hard to block on reaction (wara j.C fakeout, arcueid 5B mixups), some are incredibly hard to block on reaction (ciel 2CC mixups, sp00ky) and some are literally impossible to block on reaction (kohaku and akiha's instant overheads, fuzzy guard setups). Although this is balanced by a large range of defensive options (dodge, shield, jump) you will need to have a decent "read" on your opponents (some weeaboo fags call this "yomi") and you won't have that at the beginning of a match. Thusly, you do not ever want to be hanging back. You want to be the guy on offense, because being on defense is very bad VS many characters (against some it's not a massive problem though, lol kouma), however there are times when you need to suck it up and accept that you've been pinned down and the opponent is going to run down his offensive game on you. Which brings me to the main point of this section:

tl;dr: FUCKING BLOCK ON WAKEUP, STOP ASSUMING YOU ALWAYS HAVE AN ESCAPE OR COUNTERATTACK ROUTE ON WAKEUP, YOU FUCKING DON'T.
Block, let them run whatever shit they want to, and look for a hole to poke out. If you can't spot one, look for a pattern to shield. Certain characters like Nanaya and V.Sion thrive on putting you in the corner and keeping you there. If Nanaya is keeping you locked in the corner for 30 seconds at a time, don't assume you're doing something wrong. Nanayas do this at the top level of play also. Just be patient, eat his pathetic 500dmg throws (lol nanaya) and wait for your escape route. Being able to detect that will only come with experience.



NOBODY CARES ABOUT YOUR ARC DRIVE FINISH. Yeah Nanaya's arc drive looks pretty fucking cool and does nice damage and WILL GET YOU KILLED VERSUS ANYONE WHO HAS A DECENT IDEA OF WHAT THEY'RE DOING. The same goes for last arcs. If you're dicking around in casuals feel free to throw arc drives and last arcs everywhere with abandon but if you're seriously interested in graduating past the "might as well be playing MUGEN" stage then you need to accept that the vast majority of arc drives, and all last arcs, are useless in competitive play. At US level you might get away with throwing out arc drives like arcueid's or kohaku's every now and again but you need to accept that these are punishable on reaction by many better players and would practically never work in Japan (although if you're reading this you're probably in the US or EU and will never graduate past hurf blurf mashy blood)




CASUALS DON'T MEAN SHIT. Don't get me wrong here, I'm not shitting on netplay, I actually think it's reasonable to hold tournaments or even play for lower sums of money on very low delay netplay. But any match where you are not putting something on the line, does not matter. If you lose it does not matter. You didn't lose anything. There are only 2 reasons to play casuals, whether IRL or on netplay. To get better, to have fun, or (almost always) both. When you're playing in casuals, don't try to win. Try to play well, because that's the only thing that matters. If you're playing well, you're getting better. And if you're playing well, you're having fun. I've had hundreds of "fun" matches, and by no means did I win anywhere near all of them. Every loss you suffer on netplay or IRL casuals brings you one step closer to not losing when you're actually putting something on the line, whether it be a money match or a tournament or a league. SO don't get fucking bent out of shape because some guy beat you 20 times in a row, some of the best players I know only got where they are by losing 20-0 to people like sp00ky all day long.




YOU HAVE MORE THAN ONE BLOCKSTRING. I am really sick of seeing this. Warakia players doing 2ABC 5C 22B constantly, Nanaya players doing 2ABC 5A over and over again (lol), just to name a few. What I do is break all my moves, and "techniques", into "blocks". Take Nanaya. Let's say his "blocks" are all his ground normals, 236A, IAD j.B, empty IAD, 22C, dash, and throw. There's probably more but that's just an example. Using these blocks, select several of them entirely at random and do them. Let's say I picked at random 5C 2C 5B IAD j.B dash throw. That's a perfectly acceptable blockstring for Nanaya. Obviously after making up these random strings you have to test them (2C 5C 5B would not work, for example) but the general idea is to learn all your move ranges and be making up new strings on the go constantly. Melty is an incredibly psychological game, this isn't super turbo where you can do the same shit over and over and some chars simply can't escape it, melty has several universal defence systems that let people fuck your shit up if they have a very strong suspicion of what you're going to do.

IF YOUR ENEMY IS ON THE DEFENSIVE AND DOES NOT KNOW WHAT YOU ARE GOING TO DO, HE CANNOT COUNTER IT UNLESS HE GETS VERY LUCKY. BE UNPREDICTABLE.







That's pretty much the major points that I see most newbies messing up on. If anyone else wants to contribute newbie tips to this horrible idea of a thread please do so, there are plenty of people more qualified than me to do this.
<Irysa> arcana heart 3 just red ringed my 360 im not even joking
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<Sabator> BBCS RED RINGED MINE
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Offline Lord Knight

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #1 on: March 01, 2008, 08:54:45 AM »
This is actually a big one I see a lot - If you're opponent is using a special for some reason in their blockstring, that doesn't always mean it's a free ticket to 2A land. Usually there's a REASON they use it, and they may still have frame adv. See what they do after that special first, then react later. (Good examples would be Akiha 214B, Nanaya 236, Nero deer, etc).
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Offline DarkSaint

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #2 on: March 01, 2008, 09:19:35 AM »
The not blocking on wake up is something I see a lot of when I play a noob. There is someone that I'm trying to get to improve and he told me it doesn't matter if he blocks, so I took it upon myself to do simple timed jC punishes on him(because he thought their was a window and would thus keep attackinguntil he figued that blocking was the best way to go. Now, after that I saw another problem. He was constantly doing the same attack after he blocked. This time I didn't tell him and proceeded to force him to block like before and then ground shield and punish him even more. Is there a way for me to help him without routinely beating him down?(he started playing before me and now I'm heads and shoulders above his level of play)
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Offline F9|Chibi

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #3 on: March 01, 2008, 10:22:48 AM »
WATCH YOUR TECHING HABITS.

If you keep teching forward, and your opponent has more then one brain cell, then he's going to hurt you for it. Just fall straight down and try something on wake up instead (if it's warranted, such as a backdash or jumping straight up).
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Offline pbj_mixxa

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #4 on: March 01, 2008, 12:15:06 PM »
SO don't get fucking bent out of shape because some guy beat you 20 times in a row, some of the best players I know only got where they are by losing 20-0 to people like sp00ky all day long.

This is easily what I find hardest to deal with.  Sometimes I don't have a problem losing 20+ times in a row, and other times I have to vent my anger on the nearest object (I might need a new stick now!  ;D)!  I know I just need to be more patient, but it's pretty hard once you get the "Am I ever going to get better?" mentality going.

Also, I go for reversal dps quite a lot which I know is a bad habit.  I can at least say I'm suppressing that habit a lot better now.
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Offline Zaelar

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #5 on: March 01, 2008, 01:01:12 PM »
I know I just need to be more patient, but it's pretty hard once you get the "Am I ever going to get better?" mentality going.


If that happens, or you are just angry at the game for whatever reason, take a break.  Sometimes playing an alternate character is enough, although you're probably just going to get beat down even worse.  Get a snack, watch some porn, whatever, and come back ready to try again.

For my tip...start with the basics.  Don't worry about doing your character's best combos right away, just get basic ones down.  It's better to play with combos that do 90% damage than combos that drop 70% of the time.  Do standard mixups, not flashy stuff.

Don't watch me play and think thats where to start.  I do almost the exact opposite of everything in this thread.  Look for vids of sp00ky if you want an example of sticking to the standard stuff that works.

Offline DarkSaint

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2008, 01:45:00 PM »
I also have a few bad habits. I like to punish tech punishes and blockstring gaps. My 236C with Ciel seems to have a mind of its own sometimes. I know when to use it and when not to, but the damn thing just over powers my train of thought sometimes. For example when playing Satsuki I know its a double-edged sword to ex hiero her iad jC, half of the time I can control myself the other half I'll get my brain bashed in after she no shows her jC charge and blocks instantly. I also shouldn't drink and play.(it screws up my reaction time and overheads pick me apart in this state) Wake up attacks can work, BUT, your timing must be excellent on not just your move and input, but you have to recognize what move your opponent is using, did he press it so it would connect the instant I'm up, or is it some crap that my opponent threw out there just because he could and now he will pay for it. The most common thing is for someone to spam 2A, if you see this forget your wake up attack(unless you have timing of epic proportions, or you just happen to be LUCKY-like me 45% of the time)and block.
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<kijea> i will suck ur dick

Offline Reiku Tohno

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2008, 06:16:17 PM »
I have no problem with losing that much in a row, in fact, it makes me feel better if i win at least once...knowing someone out there is much much better than me makes me want to have a match with them even if I end up totally beat down...but hey, that's one way to get better...ALWAYS CHALLENGE YOURSELF...there's no point in playing without a challenge...where's the fun in that?

oh yeah, some I've seen, although i can be called a noob myself but i've gotten better, keep blocking low, while some don't block low at all, try to watch your opponents movements before they attack, if they jump, don't block low, (duh), also if you're in the offensive, don't use much of slow attacks if it would be more likely blocked...

that's all i can say from my experience
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Offline Alfonse

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2008, 06:39:37 PM »
When I lose, I become severely demoralised, even more so if it's against a human.  :psyduck:
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Offline tenkai#

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2008, 07:27:05 PM »
It's safe to say that whenever someone destroys you on netplay or in real life, that opponent you're facing has also been destroyed by an opponent at a previous time. Nobody automatically becomes a great player upon picking up the game; everyone has to begin somewhere (even players like Kubo and Yukinose started out as beginners who were practicing those BnBs over and over again  :psyduck: supposedly). It's easy to get discouraged, but try to take your beatdowns as learning opportunities. If you get beaten 0-20, then there is definitely something you're doing wrong that your opponent is punishing, and at that point, you should be able to figure out what it is.

Oh yeah, and be sure to play more. That can be kind of important.

Offline DarkSaint

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2008, 07:44:57 PM »
When I lose, I become severely demoralised, even more so if it's against a human.  :psyduck:

If you get beaten by the comp chances are human players will beat you also. I also believe losing is a good thing, but only when you learn from it. If you have to take baby steps to get better then take them. This is not the kind of game that you can just pick up and be better than everyone after a few weeks. There is always someone better and that should be your drive to improve yourself(I know it's mine) The thing about it is there are some people who i can beat without putting much effort into it, and some people who own me when I'm playing my hardest. The days of 20 losses and no wins are over for me, but it still doesn't get much better than that. If my opponent is really good I usually manage to get one cheap win off, but I learn what they were exploiting and what I could have done in certain situations to take advantage of their mistakes. Experience counts also.
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Offline c-nero 5[c]

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2008, 08:43:36 PM »
I also have a few bad habits. I like to punish tech punishes and blockstring gaps. My 236C with Ciel seems to have a mind of its own sometimes. I know when to use it and when not to, but the damn thing just over powers my train of thought sometimes. For example when playing Satsuki I know its a double-edged sword to ex hiero her iad jC, half of the time I can control myself the other half I'll get my brain bashed in after she no shows her jC charge and blocks instantly. I also shouldn't drink and play.(it screws up my reaction time and overheads pick me apart in this state) Wake up attacks can work, BUT, your timing must be excellent on not just your move and input, but you have to recognize what move your opponent is using, did he press it so it would connect the instant I'm up, or is it some crap that my opponent threw out there just because he could and now he will pay for it. The most common thing is for someone to spam 2A, if you see this forget your wake up attack(unless you have timing of epic proportions, or you just happen to be LUCKY-like me 45% of the time)and block.

Keep doing it over and over. Learning how to use punishers is something that you can only learn through trial and error. Every time Satsuki punishes your 236C you get slightly better at using it. One thing I often do is enter the 236 motion if i expect the enemy to do something punishable (chaos summons, akiha flametongue, etc) and if they don't I just go back to blocking, whereas if they do I can immediately just hit C.
<Irysa> arcana heart 3 just red ringed my 360 im not even joking
<Sabator> LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
<Sabator> BBCS RED RINGED MINE
<Sabator> FUCKING ANIME GAMES MAN

Offline mizuki

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2008, 10:54:25 PM »
The not blocking on wake up is something I see a lot of when I play a noob.

Are you calling me a newb?
what the fuck is this game

Offline Twinniss

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2008, 07:46:50 PM »
lol 90% of the time id do 22b with sacchin on wakeup. sometimes i get destroyed other times, its a easy 1k damage

btw id think casuals matter a lot. the point is being your actually playing someone. Thus this gives you experience on how generally your opponents would think. Chances are they all read the same guide on the same bnbs with the same blockstrings(okay so a character is gonna have more than one blockstring, but once you experience all the options they have for blockstrings thats better than not knowing any of their options with blockstrings). so playing one guy playing a specific character is gonna give you somewhat of an idea of how another guy plays the same character.

also casuals are the time for experimentation, which equals bigger stuff in tournaments, and not screwing up. And it might help you read up on opponents better. a good example is brandon, went to like 1 or 2 tourneys before that had only 3 people playing. Chances are those past tourney experiences didnt help him as much as the netplay casuals he does all the time.
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Offline S-Blade

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2008, 08:40:32 PM »
And the key to getting better regardless of the situation:

Ask yourself what you're doing wrong, and/or why you performed the way you did. Answer that question in as much detail as possible, shit write down a list it helps because you'll remember it easier. And when you find the solution, don't fucking go into netplay some more as if nothing happened and the rest of the improvement process will naturally take its course. Actually FOCUS and think about the solution and keep it in your head as you play until remembering it becomes habit or second nature. Otherwise the above process of finding out what you were doing wrong was all for naught and, in all seriousness, you really are just mashing on buttons (in a sequential, extremely predictable cycle where loss is part of the cycle).

The above doesn't just work for MB, or even all games in general either. It works on anything that can be judged and repeated. In fact, 100% of you have this skill and use it routinely in some other aspect(s) of life but aren't applying it to MB and are using the game as a brainless time killer. And you wonder why you don't get better.

Heat to Sabator for making this thread and the initial post. It's about time.
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Offline DarkSaint

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #15 on: March 05, 2008, 09:11:28 PM »
The not blocking on wake up is something I see a lot of when I play a noob.

Are you calling me a newb?

*Wonders if I should run away and not think about posting this*

When I was posting that I meant when I get a knockdown on someone and then dash to them and repeatedly press 2A before they wake up and they still get hit by the 2A OVER and OVER again after repeating this and even telling them that they need to block when they see this, and they still keep falling for it, then that person is a noob. Generally against people with equal skill or are better than me I don't resort to 2A mashing.

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Offline mizuki

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #16 on: March 05, 2008, 09:17:31 PM »
The not blocking on wake up is something I see a lot of when I play a noob.

Are you calling me a newb?

*Wonders if I should run away and not think about posting this*

When I was posting that I meant when I get a knockdown on someone and then dash to them and repeatedly press 2A before they wake up and they still get hit by the 2A OVER and OVER again after repeating this and even telling them that they need to block when they see this, and they still keep falling for it, then that person is a noob. Generally against people with equal skill or are better than me I don't resort to 2A mashing.

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Don't worry, I suck at MBAC lol.
what the fuck is this game

Offline Lolihunter Ota

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #17 on: March 05, 2008, 09:31:06 PM »
wall of text
all this comes from a guy who sucks at melty blood. you fucking failed at using nanaya, of all characters

lolololol

dont go around making topics about people who suck at mb while you pretend to be good. faggot
« Last Edit: March 05, 2008, 09:38:21 PM by Lolihunter Ota »

Offline Abstract Nonsense

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #18 on: March 05, 2008, 10:01:10 PM »
wall of text
all this comes from a guy who sucks at melty blood. you fucking failed at using nanaya, of all characters

lolololol

dont go around making topics about people who suck at mb while you pretend to be good. faggot

The advice was sound, though the presentation was aggressive, as evidenced by the amount of agreement in this thread. I fail to see why him losing to you matters at all.

Furthermore he never claimed he was good, in fact, he explicitly stated that there were people more qualified than him to give advice.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2008, 10:05:56 PM by Abstract Nonsense »
[01:46] <@BNAK_OF_AFRIKA> would u get a foot job from mech hisui
[01:46] <MrTopHat> Depends, can the feet do anything
[01:46] <Coren> they have motor skates
[01:46] <MrTopHat> : |  [20:39] <Pfhor> I am going to murder all of you

Offline Lolihunter Ota

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #19 on: March 05, 2008, 10:13:38 PM »
wall of text
all this comes from a guy who sucks at melty blood. you fucking failed at using nanaya, of all characters

lolololol

dont go around making topics about people who suck at mb while you pretend to be good. faggot

The advice was sound, though the presentation was aggressive, as evidenced by the amount of agreement in this thread. I fail to see why him losing to you matters at all.

Furthermore he never claimed he was good, in fact, he explicitly stated that there were people more qualified than him to give advice.
anyone who has been in a melty blood irc channel with him would know what im talking about

lewl

Offline c-nero 5[c]

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #20 on: March 06, 2008, 02:31:11 AM »
wall of text
all this comes from a guy who sucks at melty blood. you fucking failed at using nanaya, of all characters

lolololol

dont go around making topics about people who suck at mb while you pretend to be good. faggot

The advice was sound, though the presentation was aggressive, as evidenced by the amount of agreement in this thread. I fail to see why him losing to you matters at all.

Furthermore he never claimed he was good, in fact, he explicitly stated that there were people more qualified than him to give advice.

2 posts, both of them blatant trolling, don't bother
<Irysa> arcana heart 3 just red ringed my 360 im not even joking
<Sabator> LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
<Sabator> BBCS RED RINGED MINE
<Sabator> FUCKING ANIME GAMES MAN

Offline Alfonse

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #21 on: March 06, 2008, 03:12:01 AM »
Now where's that Penny Arcade strip about internet anonymity?  :V
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Offline Lolihunter Ota

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #22 on: March 06, 2008, 07:46:37 AM »
wall of text
all this comes from a guy who sucks at melty blood. you fucking failed at using nanaya, of all characters

lolololol

dont go around making topics about people who suck at mb while you pretend to be good. faggot
The advice was sound, though the presentation was aggressive, as evidenced by the amount of agreement in this thread. I fail to see why him losing to you matters at all.

Furthermore he never claimed he was good, in fact, he explicitly stated that there were people more qualified than him to give advice.

2 posts, both of them blatant trolling, don't bother
gb2 4chans /jp/ board and stay there. im sure you can become way better by beating all the melty blood newbs there  :slowpoke:

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Offline ..

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #23 on: March 06, 2008, 03:41:05 PM »
wall of text
all this comes from a guy who sucks at melty blood. you fucking failed at using nanaya, of all characters

lolololol

dont go around making topics about people who suck at mb while you pretend to be good. faggot

 I fail to see why him losing to you matters at all.


Offline Arcueid

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Re: "Why do I suck at this damn game?" Newbies read dis
« Reply #24 on: March 06, 2008, 04:14:20 PM »
Eh I know I'm not good at Melty Blood and that it'll be a waste of my time if I try to take on players over online right now, but that won't stop me from practicing to the point where I can at least get one round off them.

Instead of complaining how much you suck at playing the game, that time can be better spent honing your skills. There's a practice mode for a reason.