Melty Bread Forums
Misaki Town Bakery => Melty Blood Auditorium => : Komidol September 20, 2011, 11:58:33 AM
When's Melty on Steam?
ahaha that's no--wait, what?
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So we all remember the work that had to be done with MBAC for prepping computers for tourny. Let's start out with a real serious list of what a computer needs to be acceptable for tournament. Things such as optimum USB Polling Rate, graphic/power settings, window size, etc.
I think my biggest concern is since we all run wide screens these days the spacing may look/feel harder if everything is stretched out, and I'm no one is willing to deal with that. I definitely vote for a window mode convention of some sort. correct aspect ratio as a requirement. I know there is only so much we can do before it actually comes out, but let's pull bring up some of the old MBAC experiences for now.
Try not to get too mad thinking about it...computers are better, people have more PC compatible sticks, and the software will be better. I don't think there will be as big a problem with this as there used to be.
Edit: So I guess we'll just have a checklist on each setup.
Current Checklist:
-Set USB Polling Rate to 250hz.
-Disable all power saving features that reduce PC performance. Display Dimming/Turn Off/Brightness Dimming, Computer Sleep/Idle/Hibernate/Standby/Shutdown, Hard Disk Standby, Lid Close/Sleep Button Actions/Power Button Actions, Processor power saving mode, Low Battery Actions included.
-Disable all automatic programs that automatically perform functions or programs that would generate actions without manual input. This includes virus scanners, Skype, and messenger progams.
-Disable all screensavers and graphic themes/altering applications, this includes programs such as flux or background changers. Also please make sure all graphics are worksafe for public tournaments.
-At minimum, 2 working USB ports are going to be needed if you're donating a PC to the tournament.
Because there will undoubtedly be patches, we should all launch the game and play a round with the two most graphic intensive characters for a round on the most processor intensive mode (come onnn Team Battle).
Only after all these checks are made with two sticks that people hopefully donate for use so there isn't constant switch out, should we consider a setup "playable." Each players will play directly from one setup, or software mauve develops through a potential LAN feature will be playable. If there is recording or streaming, it is to be done from an HDMI split on another computer or graphic recording should be done beforehand.
It's encouraged that you:
- Have a PS3 Stick as PS3 converters are very reliable. Alternatively, please have a PC compatible stick. Having to switch out converters are a pain.
- Be comfortable using other people's sticks during casuals. This is so we don't have to switch out every match.
- *A note to keyboard players. One you should probably look at this thread (http://www.meltybread.com/forums/melty-blood-auditorium/transitioning-from-keyboard-to-stick-guide-for-mb), because keyboard player compensation is a huge hassle for tournament organizers. If you absolutely must use a keyboard (or pad for that matter), you should have a USB convertor with you, and if that convertor creates "unfair" lag for you, there is nothing we can do to compensate. If your convertor has strange driver issues (as in you don't have drivers appropriate software with you), there is nothing we can do to compensate and you may not be allowed to use that at tournament. Further more native keyboards, even if USB, are not allowed. On one keyboard there is not enough room for two players. If you use 2 keyboards it will map the same output from the computer and there is a chance of cheating/accidentally hitting the opponents keys. If you want to use a keyboard you must have a key-stick or some other game controller device with keyboard keys on it. It's actually more expensive to have this made, and while it was just something that "looked funny" on PS2, it will need to be re-configured on computers. So it should be easy to install/setup as well at minimum cost to the computer being used. If you do not have a custom joystick or otherwise, you should look into getting a USB game pad. This game is not designed to be played on keyboard.
When the game is released will set specifics about the game features, such as window size and tournament options. For now, if the arcade and PS2 release are any indication,
-Set your graphics card to launch Melty Blood in 4:3 aspect ratio. This is to solve the problem I mentioned before with playing the game on widescreen.
I think it would be best to generally have your computer set on the default game graphic settings we conventionalize, because that's what will be used at tournaments. [/s] Needs updating.
We should also make these conventions within the capable realm of mauve's software. That may mean window mode.
-All the latest patches for Current Code.
-All of mauve's files. (MBACCTool)
-USB Polling Rate changer program.
-Tournament Organization Software.
-Commonly used streaming/recording software. (XSplit/Flash Media Encoder)
And of course donators should be prepared to have those things used/installed on their computers in addition to a copy of Current Code installed before coming. I think it would be good to if we had something like a player cam so we can always record the hype (especially if we're not streaming and just saving match replays.)
This is all really fucking important, if you want to play competitively, do not just get CC and launch it on fullscreen settings on your madcatz ps2 3000ms converter with character sprites 1.5 times their average width. It will mess with your spacing and execution.
If this shit is well prepared, it means tournament setup is as easy as plugging all the shit in and launching/closing some applications.
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Both NVIDIA and ATI have a full screen while maintaining aspect ratio option in their driver settings. With that in mind, it should be standard to run the game at full screen 4:3.
As for USB polling rate, I've always wondered about how much it actually changes. Cause I've played with and without changing polling rate and I didn't really notice any difference.
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Well, since I'm going to make local tournaments in early 2012, this thread can be useful
Is possible to stream the match if I use the HDMI out (common in notebooks/laptops/netbooks and today's VGAs) and send the signal to a capture card + another PC, without input lag the match?
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Well, since I'm coming to make local tournaments in early 2012, this thread can be useful
Is possible to stream the match if I use the HDMI out (common in notebooks/laptops/netbooks and today's VGAs) and send the signal to a capture card + another PC, without input lag the match?
Why wouldn't you just play on the PC and stream the game using something such as xsplit?
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cause running MBAACC and a capture program + stream at the same time will probably rape it
Good thread btw
edit: IIRC I hear people used to do lan netplay to spec the computer with MBAC on it with MBcaster then stream from the spec
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Why wouldn't you just play on the PC and stream the game using something such as xsplit?
Prolly safer to run a stream from another pc.
That way you can eliminate that as a potential problem. ie. performance issue (whether it's the stream or MB having a problem).
If you have the stream on the same pc running the game:
What if you have problems with the stream while a match is going on?
If the pc crashes for some reason, is it better to lose only a stream or a match, or both?
The pc might not have enough ports for input with people playing and whatever peripherals the stream requires.
What if there is not enough space for the players and the commentator and the guy running the stream around the one pc? (with cable length limits and such)
I just think that the less shit plugged into a tourney machine, the less likely it is for problems to come up that interfere with a match.
-TexasTim-
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I would advise the following:
-Output the game to a tournament-standard monitor from the HDMI port on the PC.
-Power/conservation settings should be turned off completely -- you're going to be plugged into a socket. That and turn your goddamn screensaver off.
-Set the USB polling rate to 250hz.
-Highly advise people to use PS3 pads and sticks
-Do not stream from the same computer people are playing on. If you're playing before mauve releases anything, just split the HDMI signal (it should not need to be decrypted, so it'll work). Post-release, run the game in spectator mode and have the stream setup spectate over LAN.
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Aren't PS3 sticks the ones that won't work on AMD chips?
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So ideally the set-up would be one PC running the game and one PC running the stream.
The PC running the game would of course need to be capable of doing so smoothly and with multiple monitors (assuming you want to have a screen for each player), and I doubt the game will be very demanding. So any GPU capable of running a dual monitor set-up and the game along with enough processing power to handle it while also being able to connect to the capture card of the streaming PC. This probably means you're going to need a mid-tier or high-tier GPU in order to have the necessary slots. It should have enough USB slots to accommodate everything. I think this pretty much means 2 slots will probably be used for mouse and keyboard and you'll need 2 more for controllers. Really shouldn't be an issue.
Dual monitor set-up is not necessary. You can play on a single monitor with the players seated beside each other, or you can seat them across from each other with the monitors back-to-back. It just depends on what you want to do. The details still apply though. Your monitor(s) will take up a DVI slot and your mini-HDMI slot will be used to connect to the capture card.
As far as GPU goes, anything mid-tier ($100-200) or high-tier ($200-300) will probably be fine. If you have a flagship tier GPU ($300+) then good for you. Most if not all of these GPUs will have 2 DVI slots and 1 mini-HDMI slot. This should be sufficient. Your DVI slots will be used for your monitors and your mini-HDMI slot will be used to connect to the capture card of the streaming PC. Since the monitors are connected through DVI you'll definitely need speakers if you're running dual monitors, and if you're only using one monitor you can use the associated cable with the audio jack to connect to the PC and use the built-in speakers if don't want to use better speakers.
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As for the streaming PC...
Obviously you're going to need a capture card.
Any problems associated with streaming almost always have to do with CPU and/or bandwidth. This is of course assuming that your GPU(which has very minimal impact on streaming in the first place) and CPU were enough to handle the game on whatever settings you're playing on in the first place. If you're experiencing slowdown, it's going to be CPU bottlenecking, and if you're experiencing lag/latency it's because of bandwidth.
Ideal CPUs:
Core i5 2500k / i7 2600k
Core i5 / i7 8xx / 9xx Series
AMD Phenom X4 / X6
I doubt Melty Blood will be more demanding than say SC2 or BF3, so lower end CPUs will probably be fine. I really wouldn't want to take my chances though to prevent technical difficulties during a tournament.
Ideal Upload Speed:
480p (720x480): 750-1000kbps
720p (1280x720): 1500-3000kbps
1080p (1920x1080): 3000-5000kbps+
No idea how relevant any of this rambling is but have some info anyways.
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You lugging around a desktop(s) to tourneys son? I sure as hell aint. Ima lappy tappy it all the way home.
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That would probably be the main set-up for finals and whatever else they want live streamed. I would expect the people running the tournament to be providing it if they want to be live streaming. Live streaming takes a lot more than say simply recording all the matches with fraps. It becomes much simpler, easier, and less prone to problems if you just record everything and upload it later instead of streaming it live.
As for your question, I wouldn't have any problem transporting my desktop around. I'd just be really pissed if something happened to it.
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We could actually do ghetto cab setups if Mauve includes a LAN option. Lan the two computers and both people can play on them back to back (for top 8 at majors, atleast). Also, updated the first post with the information you've guys included and a bit more from my own experience.
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You can do the same thing with just one computer. A lot of mid-end cards come with 2 DVI and 1 HDMI port and you can output the same thing to two different monitors and a capture card.
EDIT: Synyster Spirit already said it in his long post.
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I doubt Melty Blood will be more demanding than say SC2 or BF3
I bet mbaacc is going to be as demanding mbac so -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4QQgi4D6f0
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Probably a bit more. There are shader effects in CC and there wasn't any in AC.
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So,
is keyboard valid?
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I would say a normal keyboard wouldn't be because you essentially can control your opponent since both are mapped to the same keyboard. Also its a absolute pain setting up keyboards as they need their own drivers as well (so you would need a internet connection to get those drivers probably). Also if both of the players happen to use keyboards, sometimes both you might have overlapping preferred inputs (ex: both of you use N for the A button or something). Keyboard is also too small for two keyboard players, and even if you guys brought your own keyboards you would be limited to what buttons you would be able to map unless you both had really weird preferences (EX: Ns on both keyboards would be recognized as the same N so there would be a problem).
tl;dr I feel like its too much of a hassle.
I'd say only allowed keyboards would be something like Madscientists where he essentially just wired keyboard keys to a ps2 controller's pcb or something and has it going through a ps2 wire. (So you could probably do the same but have it go through a USB instead). So if you want to gun for keyboard go for something like that I guess.
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So,
is keyboard valid?
Maybe your custom keboard is valid (yeah, that custom keyboard w/ original keyboard keys I saw in an old thread)
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So,
is keyboard valid?
Maybe your custom keboard is valid (yeah, that custom keyboard w/ original keyboard keys I saw in an old thread)
I'm sorry I meant the custom keyboard/cigar box made from a PS2 controller. Not a regular keyboard.
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this is assuming a community that prides itself on poverty has pretty substantial technological resources
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What. That is a PS2 controller made into a cigar box with keyboard keys, dude. Using tape and tissues to fix everything. How is this substantial technological resources?
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I would say a normal keyboard wouldn't be because you essentially can control your opponent since both are mapped to the same keyboard. Also its a absolute pain setting up keyboards as they need their own drivers as well (so you would need a internet connection to get those drivers probably). Also if both of the players happen to use keyboards, sometimes both you might have overlapping preferred inputs (ex: both of you use N for the A button or something). Keyboard is also too small for two keyboard players, and even if you guys brought your own keyboards you would be limited to what buttons you would be able to map unless you both had really weird preferences (EX: Ns on both keyboards would be recognized as the same N so there would be a problem).
tl;dr I feel like its too much of a hassle.
I'd say only allowed keyboards would be something like Madscientists where he essentially just wired keyboard keys to a ps2 controller's pcb or something and has it going through a ps2 wire. (So you could probably do the same but have it go through a USB instead). So if you want to gun for keyboard go for something like that I guess.
This. Tournaments cannot support native keyboards, you need to make a USB Controller using another board that can hook up to USB. You can't even use a USB keyboard because it will recognize as a keyboard and you both can't use the same keys.
It's essentially a joypad with keyboard keys instead. You can do this but it's a huge strain for tournament organizers. I mean if we want to get streamlined like JP it'd probably be easier to just have high quality sticks hooked up to everything but one setup (the last setup can be for people who need to hook up to special configuration) so everyone can play quickly and we can get rolling. I would actually like to encourage people to just play with sticks that aren't there's, and for people to share around a bit. Let's kill this "I can't use or deal with that kind of button/stick" and just all get better, together!
And maybe this is just because of tasted the forbidden fruit of JP play, but I honestly think maybe we should consider not running double elimnation 2/3 matches. That shit not only takes forever (especially if we have to deal with PC config), it's not really needed to see who the better competitor is. I'm not saying we should full blown do one match single elim. But maybe one 3-round match instead of 2/3 matches would be better. Especially if it's double elim it'll still take a long time and give you a lot of chance to play.
Though in my personal opinion weaker players could get a lot stronger, a lot faster, if they realized "wow if I lose this one 2-round match I'm out of this entire tournament". Maybe when I get back we can start running single elim 2-round weeklies :nyoro:
Please :nyoro:
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And maybe this is just because of tasted the forbidden fruit of JP play, but I honestly think maybe we should consider not running double elimnation 2/3 matches. That shit not only takes forever (especially if we have to deal with PC config), it's not really needed to see who the better competitor is. I'm not saying we should full blown do one match single elim. But maybe one 3-round match instead of 2/3 matches would be better. Especially if it's double elim it'll still take a long time and give you a lot of chance to play.
Though in my personal opinion weaker players could get a lot stronger, a lot faster, if they realized "wow if I lose this one 2-round match I'm out of this entire tournament". Maybe when I get back we can start running single elim 2-round weeklies :nyoro:
Please :nyoro:
single elimination is absolutely the worst thing about japanese tournaments and i'll never understand anyone who defends that nonsense.
especially in a game where one single momentum shift can utterly fucking destroy you.
players aren't weak because of tournament formats, they're weak because nobody fucking plays.
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A lot of it is about running a quick, expeditious, tournament that people will want to go out to frequently and keep people in contact more than every month.
The other part of it is that knowing matchups and adapting quickly is a huge strength that good players have. Some players may not adapt that even from years of play unless they get a whiplash of going to a single elim, single match, tournament. and losing to Hare and being out of the tournament they waited all month to goto and losing within 30 seconds.
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A lot of it is about running a quick, expeditious, tournament that people will want to go out to frequently and keep people in contact more than every month.
The other part of it is that knowing matchups and adapting quickly is a huge strength that good players have. Some players may not adapt that even from years of play unless they get a whiplash of going to a single elim, single match, tournament. and losing to Hare and being out of the tournament they waited all month to goto and losing within 30 seconds.
Yeah.. I'm calling bullshit and Japan fanboyism on this one.
It's the environment. People can't get better if they can't train. They can only train where there are players. This isn't like you can just go to an arcade every day and get exposed to a hundred different players with a hundred different playstyles in America. It doesn't happen; it can't happen.
There are motivated people, who have the talent and ability to adapt, who just can't get the environment needed to see not just what they can do but their opponents can do. It leads to the dominating players focusing more on grinding the techniques of the game rather than their mental game. Setting it to a single elimination format would only exacerbate this problem. Which is a lot of what people complain about when they look at 'anime games.' Set play puts less focus on technique wars and more on the mental game, as there is more time to train your opponent rather than simply recognizing his style and running counter to it.
You need to adapt either way, if you can't you'll lose no matter what, but nobody would go out to events if they knew they were just going to get reamed without a second chance, because the environment does not support them being able to train up their overall game experience for them to invest so much in so little.
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I think it's true that for America it's harder to get out and run more tournies, which is why single elim wouldn't work for like majors and stuff, but if it's a small local and people want a reason to go out and see each other every week, why not run small, quick tourneys that you can do in a Friday night? If there are more small tourneys like that, people will be more prepared for big tourneys. We can do both!
At the end of the day, a tourney is often a full day dedication because it's not only 2/3 matches - but also it's double elimination. That means you can fight 18 rounds and still get last place! That's 29.4 minutes of play if no one stops the clock with heat! That's 1 round! Sure, it means you get to play a lot, but it also means a 64 man tournament takes 8 hours to run(on average length, upwards of 15 with maximum play time). Let's start engaging in some activities that people can do on a Friday night and get people playing for good tourney EXP, and always play the most and be at our best, all the time!
I don't think there's anything we need to improve on in our majors/big regional tournaments. We just need to overcome the lack of game centers and make efforts to play more. A small, quick tournament is extra incentive to do that.
I honestly feel like the mental game isn't any weaker from single elim. If nothing else, it's stronger, because those decisions mean all the more, and risk taking means that much more. "If I take this silly risk here, I may lose, but I have the entire next match to make up for it." Rather than "Do I have enough health to potentially survive this one match right here right now and am I prepared to head home in this round if I don't and lose." I think it puts more emphasis on making smarter decisions, faster! Making smarter decisions quicker I feel is more effective than learning them the hard way through longer casual sessions or even tournament matches.
There's definitely pro's and con's to both. A lot of people are calling me out recently saying things like "those top JP players really aren't as good as everyone says they are" and you say this format is "Japan fanboyism", but I think if the community works hard (despite that it may be more difficult because we're not just a train station ride away from a major arcade), we can really proliferate melty and get more people playing locally. I want to turn more potential players into real players and see people get better. At the end of the day, those mythical Japanese players, that I have met, ARE THAT GOOD. We can be too. I mean, in the end, we want our skill level to be as high as JP, right? Is that not a goal we have, to win? A lot of people play to have fun and for the community but mostly everyone here has a competitive spirit that drives them to keep playing and getting better. Let's do that. And right now, JP melty is the strongest region for melty. So why not borrow their playing institutions a bit and try it out? I honestly see no harm in it! :psyduck:
I mean, maybe this isn't the same for everybody, but I definitely, definitely remember every mistake that led to me losing in tournament. But what sent me to losers? Usually not as much a month or two down the line. I think those single-elim mistakes stick out more.
Like I'm saying, venue fee is huge in America, I'm not saying lets make NEC with the 30$ venue fee a single elim tournament. But hey, maybe Connecticut at battlegrounds wants to run weeklies and generate more interest in the game. Maybe Rokrew wants to find more people at 8 on the break if they say hey, we're here every Friday. These sorts of things that create entry ways for new players.
I mean, in accordance with the thread, I'm trying to consider time management for tournament organizers. That way we can run those extra events and those team tournaments. I don't want to fight, that's just how I feel, really.
I also really like team tournaments! I would like to see more of those, for sure.
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I agree I don't really see a harm in trying both, if it doesnt work out then whatever
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Komidol, we don't have 64 man local tournaments for melty. Who cares if that would hypothetically take 8 hours to run if every match took as long as possible? The other side to that "oh if I take this risk I could lose and go home right here because it's single elim" argument is "well if I just diceroll they can't possibly know what I'm going to do since this is only single elim and they barely got to experience playing me"
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Since Komidol messaged me and we had it out in PMs for a bit, to prevent things from derailing further I'll summarize things.
Single elim isn't really the issue here, it's about getting people hype and interested in playing. In this case, Komidol's argument is about having more time for the casuals and hoping it'll be more motivating for players if they get beat sooner, since they'll probably lose anyway if they're going to. I actually don't really have a problem with this and am entirely in favor of more time for people to just play when they get together. My view is more that circulation of knowledge and experience is the most important thing, and that's the best way to get people interested, not just making them kinda salty when they lose.
I also don't think single elim is so much weaker mentally as it has a very different set of goals, as do 2/3 and 3/5 and any other setup really. The different format necessitates that your longer term strategy adjust along with it. Single elimination puts more focus on recognizing the opponent's style and running counter to it, and less on being able to train them. It still happens, but depending on the match goes you might not have all that many chances to do it. I don't believe America is well suited to tournaments of this format, due to players being no doubt strong mentally but having less time to familiarize themselves with each other due to distance. As I said, you can't just go to an arcade and play all kinds of people any time you feel like it. But if the goal is just to get people spending more time playing, rather than improving the quality of the tournament itself and its results, that's a pretty different thing.
My main point is that tournaments do not exist in a vacuum. There's a whole community to work with, and depending on what your goals are different formats for events can work. Hell, even a few completely insane formats would be pretty good at getting people interested. It's all about what you're trying to accomplish.
Either way, none of this has a damn thing to do with the PC setup and I'm sorry for derailing things!
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Forcing ppl to play with stick is stupid. I never played with a stick in my life and I probably won't. I can play best with keyboard. Forcing me to use a stick will only result in 1st round lose. This is preprogrammed.
I don't see a problem using a selfmade keyboard from a PS2 controller; it's still a PS2 controller. Only the keys are rearranged and swapped with PC keys. It's still the very same thing.
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Forcing ppl to play with stick is stupid. I never played with a stick in my life and I probably won't. I can play best with keyboard. Forcing me to use a stick will only result in 1st round lose. This is preprogrammed.
I don't see a problem using a selfmade keyboard from a PS2 controller; it's still a PS2 controller. Only the keys are rearranged and swapped with PC keys. It's still the very same thing.
There's one issue I could see with a hacked keyboard controller -- what happens when you feed the game input it wasn't designed to take (specifically, up/down and left/right on a pad). Granted, since MB has its roots as PC game the odds of weirdness from this are remote, but it has been an issue in fighting games, even recently. For example, you have people using Hitbox controllers in MvC3, where holding the left & right buttons will let you block both ways at the same time.
If nothing like this occurs then I would not care; nobody questioned it when people would play on hacked keyboards with a PS2 cord.
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Forcing ppl to play with stick is stupid. I never played with a stick in my life and I probably won't. I can play best with keyboard. Forcing me to use a stick will only result in 1st round lose. This is preprogrammed.
I don't see a problem using a selfmade keyboard from a PS2 controller; it's still a PS2 controller. Only the keys are rearranged and swapped with PC keys. It's still the very same thing.
It's the hassle of unplugging the stick and resetting the configuration - any pad/keyboard-controller would do it now. It just slows the tournament down. I mean it sucks you don't have majors out in Germany, and if you did fly out to another country to play I'm sure we'd compensate for you, but at the risk of holding a double standard, we want to encourage people to not use either or. As far as the tournament organization time is concerned, it's the same amount of time to hook up a keyboard/controller to a PS2, but now nearly 3x as long if we had two nice sticks good to go. Your circumstances are a little special Rowanism, I wouldn't make it the norm for the entire tournament scene which is trying to fight to go smoothly and expeditiously along side other major games at majors like NEC.
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Forcing ppl to play with stick is stupid. I never played with a stick in my life and I probably won't. I can play best with keyboard. Forcing me to use a stick will only result in 1st round lose. This is preprogrammed.
I don't see a problem using a selfmade keyboard from a PS2 controller; it's still a PS2 controller. Only the keys are rearranged and swapped with PC keys. It's still the very same thing.
There's one issue I could see with a hacked keyboard controller -- what happens when you feed the game input it wasn't designed to take (specifically, up/down and left/right on a pad). Granted, since MB has its roots as PC game the odds of weirdness from this are remote, but it has been an issue in fighting games, even recently. For example, you have people using Hitbox controllers in MvC3, where holding the left & right buttons will let you block both ways at the same time.
There's been research into this. It's not an issue in Melty since opposite inputs cancel each other out.
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-Disable all power features to save power.
This line reads really ambiguously, it kinda sounds like you are asking people to activate those features, so that they can save power.
You should maybe edit it to:
"Disable all power-saving features so PC will run at maximum performance."
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I wonder if there are any All-In-One PCs (eg. http://www.auspcmarket.com.au/img/products/e/2/e2d4866ea6828d3806235a88e5cd0a46-0.jpg?mark ) that fulfill FG requirements of having a low latency LCD screen and a CPU+GPU fast enough to run games on?
Seems like it would be the most convenient of all the options, basically just an LCD screen that happens to be able to run the game. Even better than a laptop or a console :)
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I know that my lcd has a 2ms response time. Is response time what governs lag?
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I know that my lcd has a 2ms response time. Is response time what governs lag?
No, response time has to do with the ghosting on the screen. Manufacturers do not tell you the display lag, sadly.
Here's a good thread: http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?threads/sub-1-frame-hdtv-monitor-input-lag-database.145141/
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It's the hassle of unplugging the stick and resetting the configuration - any pad/keyboard-controller would do it now. It just slows the tournament down. I mean it sucks you don't have majors out in Germany, and if you did fly out to another country to play I'm sure we'd compensate for you, but at the risk of holding a double standard, we want to encourage people to not use either or. As far as the tournament organization time is concerned, it's the same amount of time to hook up a keyboard/controller to a PS2, but now nearly 3x as long if we had two nice sticks good to go.
So you're now proposing that not only people should be playing only on stick, that they have to play on specifically provided sticks?
Hell no. You're going to have every pad player in this community looking for your head. Never mind that people like playing on their own sticks, as they are tweaked with different hardware, layouts, and so forth.
Plus, whoever's stick is on the setup is going to freak out when someone like me starts playing. D:
I know that my lcd has a 2ms response time. Is response time what governs lag?
It's one of many things. The issue is that the numbers the manufacturers provide are more or less bunk; this is something that needs to be independently tested. There's a very good FAQ about this on SRK's Tech Talk forum (http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?threads/the-new-definitive-hdtv-lag-faq.55593/), and a database of displays to be tested to have less than 16ms of display lag (http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?threads/sub-1-frame-hdtv-monitor-input-lag-database.145141/).
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So you're now proposing that not only people should be playing only on stick, that they have to play on specifically provided sticks?
Yeah I think you have to let people play on what they want, so long as you don't have issues like keyboard inputs that can input for both players and such.
But if your input device does not work when you plug it in because you have no drivers, then there is a time consuming problem to fix.
Guess we'll have to wait and see, but it's prolly safe to say this:
If your computer at home required you to install drivers to get your input device running, bring a usb device with your drivers on it to any event you go to.
Don't take off that virus condom. :fap:
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About one pressing others buttons in case of 2 keyboard: people can remove all they keys they arent going to use for playing, so they can't press buttons other then theirs. But well, it's not like people would press other buttons anyway, but this can be done...
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Contrary to popular belief, drivers are not necessary for a lot of devices that they come with. I don't know about sticks but all the pads I've plugged into my comp were usable from the get-go as long as the program in question had a way to set buttons integrated into it.
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I think it would be helpful if we had say 2-3 setups, in which one or two of the setups had dedicated stick-play setup on them. As in atleast one where we're not changing out a controller for configuration and people just sit down and play.
Dippy, if the person is willing to dedicate their stick to that setup than I doubt they're going to freak out when someone starts playing on it.
As much as I would like to see everyone use arcade sticks, I know the scene is too small to be picky about things like that. I'm just saying maybe the streaming setup or something should just have continuous matches on bracket on sticks. That'll move everything along really smoothly and quickly.
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Oh yeah, and we'll two stations with people fanning you.
One will feature hot chicks cosplaying as napkins.
The other will feature hot guys crossplaying as girls cosplaying as napkins.
All we have to ban is people who need drivers for their controller / keyboard / toaster.
If you can plug it in and play that's all that matters imo.
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Try $15 Radioshack converters son.
From 2006.
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why would you get crappy radioshack converters with inpins are like 5 dollars more but 10x better? :|
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Try $15 Radioshack converters son.
From 2006.
Why you hatin on my Radioshack converter? :psyduck:
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I'm not hating on them, I fucking loved them.
:nyoro:
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Plug and play + default configuration for the speed/hype :fap:
I sleep/unhype so hard when people goes buttom config or want to choose what keys to use >.<
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I'd like to suggest Ps2 > LPT Switch adapters but I think LPT-switch is too old for you
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I guess this is kinda related. Not sure if I need to start a new thread.
Can anyone actually find an external capture card / frame grabber that has DVI input (Not just S-Video/RCA)?
I can find some, but they are all either internal PCI/PCIE cards or crazy expensive external solutions for companies.
Figured I'd start looking for something with DVI input for when 1.07 drops.
-TexasTim-
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why would you get crappy radioshack converters with inpins are like 5 dollars more but 10x better? :|
yea inpin are the way to go
Plug and play + default configuration for the speed/hype :fap:
I sleep/unhype so hard when people goes button config or want to choose what keys to use >.<
i agree some what. only when the players switching out have no idea what they are doing. like at EVO this past year. early rounds some players took forever but as the day grew on and it was more skilled players. switching sticks, pads, button config went super fast.
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I guess this is kinda related. Not sure if I need to start a new thread.
Can anyone actually find an external capture card / frame grabber that has DVI input (Not just S-Video/RCA)?
I can find some, but they are all either internal PCI/PCIE cards or crazy expensive external solutions for companies.
Figured I'd start looking for something with DVI input for when 1.07 drops.
-TexasTim-
The Blackmagic Intensity devices (http://www.blackmagic-design.com/products/intensity/) might be what you're looking for -- none of them handle DVI directly, but they can take DVI over HDMI -- just get the correct adapter for it (http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=104&cp_id=10419&cs_id=1041902). You can get them to work over PCI-E, USB 3 or Thunderbolt. Granted, these are all a bit pricy (and that's assuming that you have hardware that accepts USB 3 or Thunderbolt!), but you're not going to get a HD digital signal on low-end devices -- the device bandwidth required is just too great.