When's Melty on Steam?
ahaha that's no--wait, what?

Author Topic: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code 1.07  (Read 278974 times)

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Offline HRGS|忍

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #250 on: June 17, 2010, 07:09:34 AM »
I had a Sega Channel. Very convenient at the time.

All I have to say is this: PS2 is going to be obsolete in a matter of a couple years. Converting to a next-gen console or even another PC port (not looking forward to it) would do wonders for it now. America's scene is pretty scarce right now so in terms of convenience it would help the players and also get the game recognized more than it already has been now. For Evo to dust off PS2s at a year like this (the year of Super and others) for Melty, its a great advancement and a great jump forward to recognition. Bet it, they wouldn't do anything PS2 related again 2 years from now.
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Offline Dark Pulse

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #251 on: June 17, 2010, 01:29:20 PM »
As did I, Silent. *Pulls out the Oreos and gives up a sleeve of them*

I loved Sega Channel to bits. At that time, it was absolutely revolutionary stuff. I found out about quite a few games I would have otherwise never had the chance to play, one of which is partially responsible for my online persona. That game would be Pulseman, developed by Game Freak - the guys who a couple years later hit payday with the Pokemon series. Plus with the sheer amount of games you were given for $15 a month, it was very, VERY worth the cost - well, after the $150 or so initial setup fee. The only downsides to it was that larger games (Mortal Kombat 3 and Super Street Fighter II definitely had this) had to be "split" due to a limitation in the size of DRAM the adaptor used - 32 Mbit/4 MByte. I know for a fact Super Street Fighter II was 40 Megabit/5 Megabyte and used bankswitching to have all of its data; MK3 and UMK3 were both 32Mbit/4MByte though so I'm not sure why they needed to split it. Sonic 3D Blast was also split this way, now that I come to think of it - That game, like MK3/UMK3, was also 32Mbit/4Mbyte.

(Yeah, I'm a bit of an expert in things related to the Genesis. Blame a site I helped found for this...)

Anyway, I agree. Then again, for Evo to really do it again in a couple years, it'd almost certainly have to be current-gen console - after all, who'd want to hook up a bunch of PCs just to do a Melty Tournament?
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Offline academico

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #252 on: June 28, 2010, 01:05:57 AM »
What is sega ringwide ???

a console???
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Offline Dark Pulse

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #253 on: June 28, 2010, 01:40:11 AM »
Sega RingWide is the arcade platform that MBAA:CC will run off of.

Quote from: Specifications
RingWide specifications

    * CPU: Intel Celeron 440 (2.0 GHz)
    * RAM: 1 GB DDR2 SDRAM (PC-5300)
    * GPU: ATI Radeon HD 2xxx with 128 MB GDDR3 SDRAM (Shader Model 4.0)
    * Output: 1 DVI port
    * Storage: 8GB CF
    * Networking: Gigabit Ethernet (1000BASE-T)
    * OS: Microsoft Windows Embedded Standard 2009
    * Other: 2 USB ports, 5.1 channel HD Audio, Sega ALL.NET online

As you can see... essentially a low-cost PC-based unit. This means that a port to PC would be rather straightforward, since that's essentially what it's already running on.
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Offline fiendmaw

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #254 on: June 28, 2010, 05:06:57 AM »
They most likely dont see a profit being made out of PC release...
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Offline Dark Pulse

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #255 on: June 28, 2010, 06:38:00 AM »
Well, what'll happen if it's not released to PC is eventually someone will make a loader for the game once the encryption is figured out.

The exact same thing happened to Blazblue, whose hardware (Taito Type X2) is also essentially a PC. Type X2 does have steeper system specs than RingWide, though.
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Offline academico

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #256 on: June 29, 2010, 11:33:40 AM »
They most likely dont see a profit being made out of PC release...

fucking corporations
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Offline Benny1

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #257 on: June 29, 2010, 06:31:17 PM »
Well, what'll happen if it's not released to PC is eventually someone will make a loader for the game once the encryption is figured out.

The exact same thing happened to Blazblue, whose hardware (Taito Type X2) is also essentially a PC. Type X2 does have steeper system specs than RingWide, though.

I've heard people saying that has input issues though...
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Offline Dark Pulse

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #258 on: June 29, 2010, 10:17:31 PM »
I've heard people saying that has input issues though...
Usually only if their PCs don't meet the original system's specs.

Taito Type X2 *is* PC hardware, just like RingWide:
Quote from: Specifications
Taito Type X²

    * OS: Microsoft Windows XP Embedded SP2
    * CPU: Intel LGA 775 CPU. Supported CPUs include Celeron D 352, Pentium 4 651, Intel Core 2 Duo E6400
    * Chipset: Intel Q965 + ICH8 (dg31pr +ich7)
    * Video output: 640x480 (VGA), or 1280x720 (HDTV 720p)
    * RAM: 667/800MHz DDR2 SDRAM. Supported capacities 512MiB, 1GiB, 4GiB.
    * GPU: PCI Express x16-based graphics. Supported GPUs include ATI RADEON (x1600Pro, x1300LE) or NVIDIA GeForce (7900GS, 7600GS, 7300GS)
    * Sound: Onboard Realtek HD 7.1 channel Sound (supports add-in sound cards)
    * LAN: 1000BASE-T 10/100BASE-TX
    * I/O ports: 1x JVS, 4x USB 2.0, 1x serial (max 2), 1x parallel port, 2x PS/2, 2x SATA
    * Audio inputs: AKG C535EB Stage Microphone, line-in (Surround 7.1)
    * Audio outputs: 7.1, SPDI/FX
    * Expansion Slots: 1x PCI Express x16 (used by video card), 1x PCI Express x4, 2x PCI
    * Storage: SATA 3Gbit/sec Hard Drives

Therefore, even with the loader, there should be no input lag, since all the loader does in this case is decrypt the game encryption and then run the game like it were a normal EXE. There should be no input lag as it's not emulating anything - input lag would only come from a system being incapable of handling it, and Type X2 is fairly powerful hardware still.

Thus, running Actress Again: Current Code on a PC would be doing much the same thing. Decrypt the game encryption, and it becomes a standard EXE that can be run. RingWide, as shown above, obviously has far more lax system specs than Type X2.

Therefore, I believe this comes down to the placebo effect. If anyone out there is heavy into BlazBlue, meets or beats these system specs, and would like to do some heavy testing to verify or deny this, I'd love to see it.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2010, 10:19:16 PM by Dark Pulse »
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Offline fiendmaw

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #259 on: June 30, 2010, 01:21:10 AM »
My computer can beat those spec,and I can say I've encountered no major input lag,I can't say if there is none for sure,since I havent been playing around with the game alot,but I can say for sure,it isnt anything over 4 delay...
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Offline Van_Artic

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #260 on: June 30, 2010, 04:33:01 AM »
If anyone out there is heavy into BlazBlue, meets or beats these system specs, and would like to do some heavy testing to verify or deny this, I'd love to see it.
i've played BBCS for a long time to the PC (i almost match those specs) i can confirm 120%, there's lag on the inputs, even a 236236 won't come out the first time, it's frustrating
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Offline AARP|ZTB

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #261 on: June 30, 2010, 03:32:14 PM »
It's almost that time, fellas. . .
zar are you even aware that your attitude is what drove people off in the first place. i think zar's attitude is worse than all of that. cause neither of you guys mean anything. but zar can poison shit around him. zar's the one that gets personal online and does realtalk that's out of line.

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #262 on: July 03, 2010, 05:45:10 PM »
i've played BBCS for a long time to the PC (i almost match those specs) i can confirm 120%, there's lag on the inputs, even a 236236 won't come out the first time, it's frustrating
A technical quibble here: Input lag will not, in any way, effect your ability to input motions. You would have to be visually confirming your motions on the screen for this to matter, and that's not happening.

However input resolution(how often the controller is polled) and the stability of the update frequency(how many +/- ms off of the timer base it will actually check for inputs) will, and are far more probable issues.

The former can be fixed by about a billion tutorials out there on upping the usb refresh rate, the latter probably not though you can try increasing the process priority in the task manager.

Offline Erkz

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #263 on: July 06, 2010, 03:58:37 AM »
Release date set for July 29th, 2010.

Also, they enabled the screenshots we ripped last time.  :slowpoke:
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Offline Van_Artic

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #264 on: July 06, 2010, 06:27:35 AM »
The former can be fixed by about a billion tutorials out there on upping the usb refresh rate, the latter probably not though you can try increasing the process priority in the task manager.
whoa i didn't know this; i'll try eventually
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Offline Dark Pulse

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #265 on: July 06, 2010, 01:10:55 PM »
Release date set for July 29th, 2010.

Also, they enabled the screenshots we ripped last time.  :slowpoke:
Two days before my birthday.

......Anyone feel like buying me a very expensive birthday gift?

I'll even blow you for it if I have to.
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Offline Celestein

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #266 on: July 06, 2010, 08:43:25 PM »
As I have the arcade version of BB:CS, I can confirm running it on a PC through the IO emulator does indeed lag, but not for the reasons people normally think.

#1. The IO board in a typex2 adds about 3~ frames of lag normally(it's just a shitty piece of hardware), arcade fighters are designed around this, so if you run it on a normal PC, there's always 3 frames of lag you can't remove built into the game, it's really rather jarring when you have them side-by-side to compare.

#2. A lot of people use Joy2Key, Xpadder, or similar programs to map their sticks to the X2 loader, both these add input lag.


That said, the encryption and security schemes on ringwide and ringedge are lightyears beyond what the TypeX and X2 used(hint: you can partially "break" the encryption just renaming a fucking file...it's that pathetic, and to fully remove it, all you do is edit a few lines to remove the reference to the USB dongle, to put it in laymans). Saying it had any security is intellectually dishonest at best.

RW and RE however are *likely* to be much more advanced, if anything like the Lindbergh, they may have auto-launching bootsector code for masking data files(i.e. reading them in anything but the arcade board will mask the files at the root level, and tampering may trigger an auto-format), and remember well RW/RE use Windows Embedded instead of Linux, the reason TypeX/X2 was so vulnerable was because they didn't remove any of the standard includes that come with Windows Xp Embedded...

There's a good chance SEGA wouldn't follow the same mistake and would build their version up to have absolutely only the necessarily included files, which would make it very difficult to casually interact with(you'd have to actually find a vulnerability to get in).

etc.

Who knows, maybe I'm wrong and we'll see a day 1 leak of MBAACC(which would suck, since I'm planning to buy it), but SEGA has a proven track record of making arcade hardware designed not to be broken very easily, took forever to break the Naomi, we're barely there with the Lindbergh, and AFAIK, we've made 0 progress on breaking the Ringedge which has already been out for awhile.

Offline Soniti

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #267 on: July 07, 2010, 10:43:08 AM »
Nice post, Celestein. Guess if we are lucky, we'll see a (region free!?) PS3 port then. I don't think we'll see a PC port until the same version has been out on console for a while.

Offline Erkz

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #268 on: July 07, 2010, 01:31:27 PM »
Not sure if related, but the guys at FrenchBread posted this on their blog along with the note that the master copy of MBAACC is finished, and their thoughts on what it was like working on MBAACC.

Maybe someone with a good grasp of moonspeak can check it out to see if there are any interesting tidbits.
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Offline Dark Pulse

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #269 on: July 07, 2010, 08:37:44 PM »
That said, the encryption and security schemes on ringwide and ringedge are lightyears beyond what the TypeX and X2 used(hint: you can partially "break" the encryption just renaming a fucking file...it's that pathetic, and to fully remove it, all you do is edit a few lines to remove the reference to the USB dongle, to put it in laymans). Saying it had any security is intellectually dishonest at best.

RW and RE however are *likely* to be much more advanced, if anything like the Lindbergh, they may have auto-launching bootsector code for masking data files(i.e. reading them in anything but the arcade board will mask the files at the root level, and tampering may trigger an auto-format), and remember well RW/RE use Windows Embedded instead of Linux, the reason TypeX/X2 was so vulnerable was because they didn't remove any of the standard includes that come with Windows Xp Embedded...

There's a good chance SEGA wouldn't follow the same mistake and would build their version up to have absolutely only the necessarily included files, which would make it very difficult to casually interact with(you'd have to actually find a vulnerability to get in).

etc.

Who knows, maybe I'm wrong and we'll see a day 1 leak of MBAACC(which would suck, since I'm planning to buy it), but SEGA has a proven track record of making arcade hardware designed not to be broken very easily, took forever to break the Naomi, we're barely there with the Lindbergh, and AFAIK, we've made 0 progress on breaking the Ringedge which has already been out for awhile.

As someone who's pretty into emulation (although a system as powerful as RingWide/RingEdge wouldn't be emulatable in realtime anytime soon) I pretty much know Sega's encryption stuff is fairly tough to crack. I'm 100% certain the encryption won't be broken on day one.

That said, there is still the fact that this is, essentially, PC hardware inside the cab, running on a fairly known OS. For what it's worth, NAOMI was a dedicated, non-standard system compared to PCs. Lindbergh is PC-based, but it runs Linux as its OS, which is considerably less "known" than Windows would be.

That said, of course, this is all easy in theory, as a lot of things are. In practice, I am sure it will be fairly hard to crack, but eventually it will be done, pure and simple. It's mostly a matter of figuring out how the system data is encrypted, and figuring out how the OS decrypts it. Not an impossible feat by any means.

So all in all, it's really just a matter of time until we have a PC version - either ported, which would be preferable, or decrypted/loaded, since by the time that's all done pretty much most PCs in existence will be running at RingWide's specs, if not considerably higher.

Nice post, Celestein. Guess if we are lucky, we'll see a (region free!?) PS3 port then. I don't think we'll see a PC port until the same version has been out on console for a while.
For all intents and purposes, MBAA:CC is a back-to-arcade port of the PS2 version of MBAA with some minor rebalancing and tweaking, and some new visual effects and such. It's very unlikely it'd get ported "back" to a console again - there was no console version of MBAC Ver. B, but the PC version was based off of that, of course.

I'm pretty sure that unless sales are ridiculously high, if we ever do get a PC port, it will likely be within 6-12 months. Porting from RingWide to PC would be fairly straightforward, I would imagine, even if they didn't add a tick to it other than the usual extra modes. (Practice, etc.)

Not sure if related, but the guys at FrenchBread posted this on their blog along with the note that the master copy of MBAACC is finished, and their thoughts on what it was like working on MBAACC.

Maybe someone with a good grasp of moonspeak can check it out to see if there are any interesting tidbits.
Wow, some of those designs look... really fucking generic. REALLY fucking generic. A few are mildly interesting, but some of them... just... wow.

French Bread have their work cut out for them - Melty is essentially all they're known for. (Those of you who've played Ragnarok Battle Offline, hush.) They have to step out of the shadows of Melty Blood, essentially, and create a game that surpasses it not just visually, but in gameplay as well - no small feat as Melty is obviously one of, if not the, most complex fighters out there. I honestly hope they can pull it off, as I'd love to see a name other than Arcsys and Capcom and Namco make it big in terms of fighting games (the minority of you who play MK are noted as well) but realistically, just going off those sprites... my opinion is less than enthusiastic.

Remember kids, just because the sprites are fluid and HD, it doesn't mean the game mechanics can't suck.
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Offline Irysa

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #270 on: July 07, 2010, 11:12:19 PM »
Quote
French Bread have their work cut out for them - Melty is essentially all they're known for. (Those of you who've played Ragnarok Battle Offline, hush.) They have to step out of the shadows of Melty Blood, essentially, and create a game that surpasses it not just visually, but in gameplay as well - no small feat as Melty is obviously one of, if not the, most complex fighters out there. I honestly hope they can pull it off, as I'd love to see a name other than Arcsys and Capcom and Namco make it big in terms of fighting games (the minority of you who play MK are noted as well) but realistically, just going off those sprites... my opinion is less than enthusiastic.

FB spent like nearly a fucking decade making Melty the game it is today.

Even if this game kind of sucks initially they're the kind of guys who will go through an unlimited amount of revisions and turn things upside down till it's where they want it to be, that alone makes me believe in them more than most developers these days. (The old SNK used to have that level of dedication but yeah...)
[17:09:40] <Roy> lol wtf, escort service prices in helsinki are fucking ridiculous
[17:10:32] <Irysa> why are you even looking at those
[17:10:52] <Roy> Looking for a reason to go to the event despite sucking at Melty

Offline Celestein

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #271 on: July 08, 2010, 02:11:13 AM »
Stuff

Ever gonna come out and play some Melty with us?  ;D

Offline Erkz

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #272 on: July 08, 2010, 07:28:40 AM »
Not sure if related, but the guys at FrenchBread posted this on their blog along with the note that the master copy of MBAACC is finished, and their thoughts on what it was like working on MBAACC.

Maybe someone with a good grasp of moonspeak can check it out to see if there are any interesting tidbits.
Wow, some of those designs look... really fucking generic. REALLY fucking generic. A few are mildly interesting, but some of them... just... wow.
Generic or not; if someone told me that the floating loli in the white dress and the Anubis-esque thing next to her were Altrouge and Primate Murder, I'd probably believe them. [Then again, this is probably because I've never seen any official pictures of them like... ever.]

Personally I'm kinda torn; while I wanna see FB do a new IP and stuff, I still haven't been able play as Arihiko/SHIKI in MB.  :V
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Offline Dark Pulse

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #273 on: July 08, 2010, 11:36:43 AM »
Quote
French Bread have their work cut out for them - Melty is essentially all they're known for. (Those of you who've played Ragnarok Battle Offline, hush.) They have to step out of the shadows of Melty Blood, essentially, and create a game that surpasses it not just visually, but in gameplay as well - no small feat as Melty is obviously one of, if not the, most complex fighters out there. I honestly hope they can pull it off, as I'd love to see a name other than Arcsys and Capcom and Namco make it big in terms of fighting games (the minority of you who play MK are noted as well) but realistically, just going off those sprites... my opinion is less than enthusiastic.

FB spent like nearly a fucking decade making Melty the game it is today.

Even if this game kind of sucks initially they're the kind of guys who will go through an unlimited amount of revisions and turn things upside down till it's where they want it to be, that alone makes me believe in them more than most developers these days. (The old SNK used to have that level of dedication but yeah...)
All too true, and a fair number of us remember how horrid the original MB was. Re-ACT was a whole different game, essentially.

Stuff

Ever gonna come out and play some Melty with us?  ;D
If I quit being lazy and find the time and have some money to bring along, yeah. Probably around or shortly after my Birthday, as by then I'll likely have some pocket money to throw in for snacks or whatever. Plus I'll really want to try out the CC cab, and be intensely jealous of you owning one. :P My main problem is I'm so used to gamepad that adjusting to levers/buttons will be a bit of a step.

Not sure if related, but the guys at FrenchBread posted this on their blog along with the note that the master copy of MBAACC is finished, and their thoughts on what it was like working on MBAACC.

Maybe someone with a good grasp of moonspeak can check it out to see if there are any interesting tidbits.
Wow, some of those designs look... really fucking generic. REALLY fucking generic. A few are mildly interesting, but some of them... just... wow.
Generic or not; if someone told me that the floating loli in the white dress and the Anubis-esque thing next to her were Altrouge and Primate Murder, I'd probably believe them. [Then again, this is probably because I've never seen any official pictures of them like... ever.]

Personally I'm kinda torn; while I wanna see FB do a new IP and stuff, I still haven't been able play as Arihiko/SHIKI in MB.  :V
Primate Murder has no picture, but is generally described as a huge white dog. As for Altrouge, I believe this is generally what Altrouge looks like:



I'm not sure if this is official (I don't think it is) but it is very nice art. It's also that "Creepy/Cute Loli" thing that Lolisauce and I both seem to like.

Altrouge would definitely be a strong candidate to put into another one, as would SHIKI, but beyond that, most of the characters wouldn't realistically stand a chance. Out of what's left of the cast, the only one who even has something special about them is Seo Akira, and that's just down to precognitive abilities she doesn't even have full control of - physically she's as strong as a normal human 14 year-old girl.

Arihiko, Ichiko, Souka, and Hanei are all 100% normal humans with nothing special about them whatsoever. Ditto for the Jinans, although Sougen could possibly be doing some crazy doctor-like things. Like Kohaku but on steroids.

Other than that, we begin to get into characters that aren't even seen, like the rest of the Arimas... so yeah.

If there's really going to be any extra characters, they'd either need to be invented for the game, because about the last two Tsukihime characters that can be pulled out are Altrouge and SHIKI.
My mom never saw the irony in calling me a son of a bitch.

Offline mauve

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Re: The MB:AA:CC thread: Current Code
« Reply #274 on: July 08, 2010, 03:51:18 PM »
As I have the arcade version of BB:CS, I can confirm running it on a PC through the IO emulator does indeed lag, but not for the reasons people normally think.

#1. The IO board in a typex2 adds about 3~ frames of lag normally(it's just a shitty piece of hardware), arcade fighters are designed around this, so if you run it on a normal PC, there's always 3 frames of lag you can't remove built into the game, it's really rather jarring when you have them side-by-side to compare.

Could I ask for a bit of a clarification on this? If the IO board has it, why does the emulator have it too? And if the arcade fighters are designed around this, why would it be noticeable?