Miyako in AA

[Veven]

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm7382796
 

[LoliSauce]

Nice!

[Light]

It's weird to see her do that much retarded damage without having to use meter.

Wow at point blank 5B. The recovery looks so fast I wonder what's the frame data on that. Maybe -2 or -3?

[xPwNaZnOwNx]

I had suspected as much, but on closer inspection they are cancelling her j421B into... something.  Whiff airthrow is my guess?  Can't quite tell but it's the only thing I can think of.

[BurstOfAnger]

I had suspected as much, but on closer inspection they are cancelling her j421B into... something.  Whiff airthrow is my guess?  Can't quite tell but it's the only thing I can think of.

I second this. In that vid, when she was doing the combo on Akiha, after the j421b there's the "are?" Miyako says when she whiffs a throw.

[LoliSauce]

It's weird to see her do that much retarded damage without having to use meter.

Wow at point blank 5B. The recovery looks so fast I wonder what's the frame data on that. Maybe -2 or -3?

F Miyako 5b is -4.

[Light]

F Miyako 5b is -4.

Frame data is out, eh? Where? : D

[LoliSauce]

The guidebook scans thread ended up turning into a frame data thread.  A few people and myself have been working on transcribing them all to the wiki, but progress has been slow.

[xPwNaZnOwNx]

I had suspected as much, but on closer inspection they are cancelling her j421B into... something.  Whiff airthrow is my guess?  Can't quite tell but it's the only thing I can think of.

I second this. In that vid, when she was doing the combo on Akiha, after the j421b there's the "are?" Miyako says when she whiffs a throw.

yeah confirmed it's a whiffed airthrow, still working out the timing on the rest of the ender but it makes even the basic air combo followup more stable on some characters.

[Kite]

I've been playing F-Miyako for a bit and these are the combos I came up with.

Full Moon Miyako Combos:

5b > 2b > 5c > 6c > 623b(delay)b >236b > 421b > whiff throw> 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > {Throw or 421c for knock down} [5500/5600]
Can be done slightly further from midscreen to the wall.

5b > 2b > 5c > 6c > 236b > 421b > whiff throw > 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [5500]
Does not work on low crouching characters.

5b > 2b > 2c > 6c > 236b > 421b > whiff throw > 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [4800]
Can be done at midscreen to the wall.

22b > 5b > 236b > 421b > whiff throw 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc throw [4350]
Can be done at midscreen to the wall.

22c > 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [3500]
Can be done anywhere.

5b > 2b > 5c > 6c > 236c> 5b > 236a > j.bc > jabc > throw [5300]
Does not work on low crouching characters.

5b > 2b > 5c > 6c > 214c > 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [5050]
Can be done slightly further from midscreen to the wall.

5b > 2b > 5c > 6c > 214c > late 5c > 214{B} > 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [5800]
Does not works on Aoko, Shiki, Nanaya, Kouma, Riesbyfe, Warachia, Roa, Kohaku, and Nero.

5b > 2b > 2c> 6c > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [4000]
Can be done anywhere.

214{b} > 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [3600]
Overhead, can be done anywhere.

214{b} > 5b > 236b > 421b > whiff throw > 5b > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [4400]
Overhead, needs to be done near a wall.

5{c} > 236a > j.bc > j.abc > throw [4000]
Overhead, needs to be done near a wall

Miyako is still able to combo after her throw. She can throw into most of her normal combos.

Throw > 5b > 5c > 6c >...

Throw > 2c > 6c >...

[Light]

Nice post there Kite.

I'm curious if the 623B -> 423B combo has character specific timing. I didn't try the combo on too many characters yet, and the monitor I play on lags, so I couldn't tell myself.

[Kite]

Nice post there Kite.

I'm curious if the 623B -> 423B combo has character specific timing. I didn't try the combo on too many characters yet, and the monitor I play on lags, so I couldn't tell myself.

Im not sure what combo you're talking about, 623b > 423b?
Taking a guess that it's the first one with the 623bb delayed. The timing for the combo is the same for all characters.

[Light]

Im not sure what combo you're talking about, 623b > 423b?
Taking a guess that it's the first one with the 623bb delayed. The timing for the combo is the same for all characters.

My bad. That is the combo I was talking about.

The delay timing for the second B in 623BB does change depending on your spacing, but it doesn't seem to be that a big of deal, since I can already kind of gauge when to input the second B at any range.

[Legendary Blue Shirt]

There hasn't been much discussion about her air stomps yet, I feel that a lot of potential with it that needs to be discovered.  The A and B versions have different startup times, but EX Air Stomp can hit people on the way down if they're in the air, possibly comboable?
I need to test more, but I've had a few successes using air stomp after an airthrow as oki, since it hits low

[LoliSauce]

There hasn't been much discussion about her air stomps yet, I feel that a lot of potential with it that needs to be discovered.  The A and B versions have different startup times, but EX Air Stomp can hit people on the way down if they're in the air, possibly comboable?
I need to test more, but I've had a few successes using air stomp after an airthrow as oki, since it hits low

Only EX air stomp hits low.  An awesome little thing about it though, is if you space it right it can crossup on oki.  I saw someone use it in one of the recent acho tourneys that Psy uploaded at the melty youtube.  Unfortunately it was timed a little late and the Arc he was going up against just jumped out of it.  It's one of the best new additions to C Miyako though, if you ask me.

[Tiggy]

I've been having trouble with F-Miyako's BnB.  I've figured out most of the problems (623BB timing, 236B immediately after -- sometimes I don't even do it  ), but the biggest one was the part after j.421B.  I was doing JC into whatever.  I got land > 5AA maybe once, then after that freestyled a couple of air combo enders after late JC>j.B into whatever.  But I see the general consensus now is whiff air throw after j.421B?  I'm guessing this eliminates the need to time the JC and puts Miyako at the perfect height to continue.

Time to go practice!  Thanks for the info guys!

[arukimi]

I've been having trouble with F-Miyako's BnB.  I've figured out most of the problems (623BB timing, 236B immediately after -- sometimes I don't even do it  ), but the biggest one was the part after j.421B.  I was doing JC into whatever.  I got land > 5AA maybe once, then after that freestyled a couple of air combo enders after late JC>j.B into whatever.  But I see the general consensus now is whiff air throw after j.421B?  I'm guessing this eliminates the need to time the JC and puts Miyako at the perfect height to continue.

Time to go practice!  Thanks for the info guys!

There's quite a lot of stuff you can do after the J421B.
One of them is whiff throw, land, 5B > 236A and continue the combo, it's safe and easy to do. Sometimes (and mostly against weird hitbox characters, like Nanaya) you'll have to walk just a bit back to make the 5B land.
You can jump cancel and time an aerial, do something and finish the combo. So far the best I did was JB > 5B > 236A (there's probably something better, though), iirc JC > 5B > 236A does less damage in the end (probably due to a lower correction value). JB > 5B > 236A does more damage than the whiff and 5B (about 100 in Wara), however, against some characters (like Wara himself) the combo will take you and your opponent off the corner and there's nothing you can do about it, so the plus damage may not be worth it.

The most damaging I know so far is whiff throw > 2C > 623B timed B > 236A and finish the combo. It's kinda hard to pull off though...last a-cho videos showed Kou trying to do whiff throw and do 623B timed B right after (skipping the 2C). The bad thing about it is that against some characters (or depending on your timing, I'm not really sure), Miyako will stay behind them (in the corner), so the motion counts as an 241B instead and you'll drop the combo (maybe you can even get punished for it!)

I guess you should try whiff throw always, just because it's safer and easier, also guarantying you the corner against the opponent. Try doing the 5B also because it's safer, later on you can start trying the 623B I guess.

[Light]

I tried messing around a bit with H-Miyako today. Combo wise, H feels like a nerfed version of F, in terms of combo potential and damage. These combos seem like decent BnBs for Miyako in H.

Corner

[2B 5C 5BB] / [2AAC 5BB] 421B whiff throw 2CB 5B jc. jBC jc. JABC air throw
2AAC x 236A 5AB jc. jBC jc. jABC air throw
             
The damage is around 4k-4.1k IIRC.

[LoliSauce]

H Miyako just...makes me sad.  It's like they took the worst parts from C and F and mashed them together.  C/F Miyako are the only ones I'm interested in.

So, I was browsing through Miyako's frame data again (from the arcade guidebook), and realized that C's air stomps are safe on block!  A/b are neutral and the EX, in addition to being a low hit, is +2!  Pretty good shit.  Also with 236a>6c being neutral on block (and giving knockdown on hit), you can easily start using that to help chip away at guard meter.  236a does 200 guard damage, but if you charge it it does 500 g damage in addition to being overhead.  That's pretty damn awesome.

Can anyone tell me what all is jump cancellable on block (normals and specials) for C/F?

[Light]

I don't think C has anything jump cancelable on block. F has the Elbow though.

[Legendary Blue Shirt]

C Miyako's dp.C is jump cancellable on block. 

I've figured out a few decent combos with C Miyako

[j.C] / [2A] > 5B > 2B > 5C > 2C > 214A > walk back slightly > 5B > 5C > air combo (need to check damage, 5k at least)
Great damage off of poke and easy to learn.  Used in the corner.

fully charged 5C > fully charged 214B > walk back slightly > 5B > 5C > air combo (need to check damage, 5k at least)
To use in mixups.  Also a corner combo.

successful 623B > j.BC > airthrow  2511 damage
Fairly weak damage but at least it's something whenever you get that move to hit.  Usable anywhere.  Only reason I bothered with this one is because I like throwing out that move in my mixups and I can get it to hit every so often.

[LoliSauce]

C Miyako's dp.C is jump cancellable on block.  

I've figured out a few decent combos with C Miyako

[j.C] / [2A] > 5B > 2B > 5C > 2C > 214A > walk back slightly > 5B > 5C > air combo (need to check damage, 5k at least)
Great damage off of poke and easy to learn.  Used in the corner.

fully charged 5C > fully charged 214B > walk back slightly > 5B > 5C > air combo (need to check damage, 5k at least)
To use in mixups.  Also a corner combo.

successful 623B > j.BC > airthrow  2511 damage
Fairly weak damage but at least it's something whenever you get that move to hit.  Usable anywhere.  Only reason I bothered with this one is because I like throwing out that move in my mixups and I can get it to hit every so often.

Eh, if the last hit whiffs you can't jump cancel, and it whiffs all crouchers still right?  Anyway, I figured it was just F ground elbows, but had to make sure.  Oh well.

Why aren't you putting 6b in after the first 5b?  It hit confirms perfectly, adds extra damage, and puts you close enough that the 2b can't possibly whiff.

What's C's best option off throw now?   TH>5c2c 214a 5bc aerial I guess?

Lastly, I hear that the command buffer is massive again, so does the 2b5c2c in your combo ever register as 22c if you do it quickly?  That shit used to piss me off in MBAC ps2.

[Legendary Blue Shirt]

Why aren't you putting 6b in after the first 5b?  It hit confirms perfectly, adds extra damage, and puts you close enough that the 2b can't possibly whiff.

Have you actually tried it?  The proration actually decreases the total damage of the combo.
It was actually a huge pain for me to un-learn the 6b after the 5b because I had it in muscle memory for MBAC.

[Light]

C Miyako's dp.C is jump cancellable on block. 

Heh. 

Doesn't sound too great for wake-up gimmicks if the second hit of 623C still whiffs on crouchers.

What's C's best option off throw now?   TH>5c2c 214a 5bc aerial I guess?

Lastly, I hear that the command buffer is massive again, so does the 2b5c2c in your combo ever register as 22c if you do it quickly?  That shit used to piss me off in MBAC ps2.

Yes and yes.

[LoliSauce]

Why aren't you putting 6b in after the first 5b?  It hit confirms perfectly, adds extra damage, and puts you close enough that the 2b can't possibly whiff.

Have you actually tried it?  The proration actually decreases the total damage of the combo.
It was actually a huge pain for me to un-learn the 6b after the 5b because I had it in muscle memory for MBAC.

Nah, my copy hasn't come in yet, so I'm just asking whatever I think of.  Seems weird that it would prorate down more, since it used to just be 75% just like the 2b, so it wouldn't really make a difference.  What does it prorate to now, and how much of a difference in damage is there between 6b and non-6b versions?