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Red Arcueid / Matchup Thread

« on: January 20, 2008, 03:38:40 PM »

Other character forums seem to have these threads, so I figured I'd make one to share my thoughts on matchups. If you disagree with some thoughts, post your own ideas and we all can agree/disagree, or agree to disagree.  Plus it can give new players some info to help them decide whether they want to play Warc or not. I use a lot of Melty Blood lingo in this and assume you know basic Warcueid strats, so I'd recommend checking the other threads on this forum if you're not sure what me or others are talking about.

Sion: I don't have much experience with this matchup, but it seems fairly even, perhaps a little in Sion's favor. If you're not careful when zoning with bloodrings as Warc, a good Sion can potentially punish one of your landings with a whip then lay on a high damage bnb. Also, her j.c can be highly competitive with Warcueid's j.b. She also has extremely high damage and a great pressure game, so play cautiously and don't let yourself get cornered.
Aoko: Fairly even matchup. A good Aoko can be a pain to fight for all characters in general, but Warcueid has projectile moves with big hitboxes, so she can fuck with an Aoko trying to build an orb fortress, or just lead in with an orb/ex teleport to clear out some orbs while she rushes down Aoko. Aoko has quite a unique mixup game that can be hard to deal with if you have no experience fighting against, however. She also has a very effective keepaway game, so don't let yourself be whittled down by her if she is running that game against you.
Akiha: Fairly even matchup, slightly in Warcueid's favor. Though Warcueid has an advantage, this fight can still be tricky considering that due to Akiha's high defense and higher than average damage, she will be hurting you a lot more per combo than you will her. However, she has no real surefire way to deal with Warcueid zoning with bloodrings other than things any other character can use (shielding or dashing under a Warcueid who isn't being careful). Akiha's pressure can be vicious, but an attentive Warcueid can fuck with the pressure of an Akiha who isn't being careful enough by hitting with a 5c623c or other long range options during a gap in a blockstring.
Shiki Tohno: Even matchup. Though he doesn't have any long range moves to mess with bloodrings, his 2c has extremely high priority and will cut through things like Warcueid's 236a. His j.c also has extremely long range and is nearly level with Warcueid's j.b, and his j.a is nothing to sneeze at as far as range goes too. His higher defense and slightly higher than average damage means he will win a battle of attrition if you both are trading combos evenly.
Ciel: A matchup in Ciel's favor, though a Warcueid can still be fairly threatening to a Ciel. The big thing that makes Ciel difficult for Warcueid is Ciel's 236c. Its a full screen ex that can easily punish a Warcueid who isn't being careful with her bloodrings. If not for that move of Ciel's, however, a Warcueid would be able to run down her zoning game on Ciel all day, so the two characters are fairly evenly matched otherwise. Ciel is a very high damage output character, however, so you don't want to take too many risks against her.
Warakia: A match in Warcueid's favor. Poor Warakia, he doesn't really have too many good matchups. Overall, he's a weak character. Warcueid's blood ring zoning can make a Warakia hesitant to throw out long range attacks and force him to eat your blockstrings. Be careful when you're on the ground versus him, however, as his cape attacks hit more often than your 5c or 5b generally will. His damage output is fairly mediocre, so even if he does catch you making a mistake in your pressure, he hurts you just as much as you would hurt him.
Nanaya: A fairly even matchup. This is another character Warcueid can run her blood ring zoning game all day on, but if Nanaya catches a gap to punish a mistake in zoning, IT HURTS. His j.c has an extremely long downwards vertical range so he can easily catch you if he's above you in the air, and he can catch you during a move recovery while you're on the ground and he's in the air. Certainly an even and winnable match, but you have to play extremely cautiously against Nanaya.
V Akiha: A fairly even matchup, in Warcueid's slight favor. While you can restrict a lot of V Akiha's movement with bloodrings, V Akiha's mobility also means she can punish more windows of vulnerability in your zoning. While her defense is also low (actually lower) like Warcueid's, a good V Akiha utilizing the 2c623b loop will easily push out more damage against Warcueid than Warcueid will versus her. Still a matchup in Warcueid's favor, you want to play extremely cautiously against this character and not leave too many openings.
Kouma: A matchup in Warcueid's favor. Kouma has high defense, so when he lands his combos on you, he will generally be hurting you more than you would've hurt him. However, he is extremely weak in the air. His dragonpunch moves are extremely effective at stuffing out people in the air, but your own bloodrings are very good against his dragonpunch, limiting a lot of his aeriel punishment options. Try to stay off the ground when fighting him and run your zoning game against him. On the ground itself Warcueid will have a hard time against Kouma with his normals that give him a lot of forward momentum, not to mention his grabs and his ex move that gives him superarmor for about a second.
V Sion: An even matchup. You can use your zoning to great degree against V Sion, but she has the fastest run dash in the game making it easy for her to punish your mistakes. Plus, her j.c is an extremely effective air move like Sion's. A character you will have to zone extremely cautiously against.
Miyako: I am guessing this is a matchup in Warcueid's favor, I am not very experienced with it. Miyako has fairly high damage output and great corner pressure, but she has no real tools for dealing with Warcueid's zoning and range.
Hisui: A fairly even matchup. Hisui is a zoning character, like Warcueid. You will want to be extremely careful when throwing bloodrings out against Hisui, since if you get hit by one of her thrown items you'll eat a counterhit and a nasty followup combo. However, like Warcueid, her damage output is fairly average, so a fight between these two characters can be a battle of attrition.
Maid Tag Team: A fairly even matchup. Hisui + Kohaku is basically Hisui without her zoning but more oki setup options, so expect an easier fight if Hisui is in the lead. Kohaku + Hisui is like Kohaku solo except she has more blockstring ending mixups. Run your typical bloodring game versus Kohaku, but be aware her 5b can anti air above her fairly well and a skillful 2c from Kohaku can catch you while you're recovering from landing after throwing out a bloodring. Kohaku's damage output is fairly average like Warcueid's, but her plant pressure and mixup ability is off the charts. Don't let yourself get caught by Kohaku.
Satsuki: A fairly even matchup. You can easily dominate Satsuki in the air with bloodrings and j.b, though Satsuki's own j.b/c can be fairly competetive with Warcueid's air normals if used by a skilled person. Though Warcueid can keep Satsuki locked down fairly well with a zoning game, the thing that evens out this matchup is Satsuki's high damage output and mixup ability. Satsuki can combo with meter into a 4k+ damage combo off of any hit usually, and she can lead into an air throw which will go into a 4 way mixup. (having to guess high/low and which way she will crossup). Play extemely, extremely cautiously against Satsuki, because once you get hit, you're going to be eating a lot of damage.
Len: A fairly even matchup. Zoning effectively against Len can be somewhat difficult, as her black cats can trip you on the ground as you land from a bloodring, forcing you to begin to eat Len's mixups. A TK icicle from her or a superjump into one of her air attacks can be brutal for you to deal with in the air as well. Also, she has extremely high combo damage, so if you find yourself cornered and pressured by her, you will need to be extremely cautious. However, with her low defense and slow movement, you can zone against her fairly well if you keep your wits about you.
White Len: A fight in Warcueid's favor. White Len is another underdog of the cast, like Warakia. She has an extremely unique mixup game that can make her pressure effective, but her damage output sucks. Its as average as Warcueid's, and the fact that a White Len player will have to change some of her combos to suit Warcueid's weird hitbox is also in Warcueid's favor. Even more of a snail than Len, its fairly easy to run your zoning game against White Len, but be wary of the ice basketballs she throws into the air with j.[c]. However, unlike Warcueid's bloodrings, her air basketballs will dissapear if she takes damage, so if you know you are going to trade with her while she's throwing out the move, hit her. White Len has extremely good damage taking ability, so just run your zoning game against her until she eventually falls.
Nero Chaos: A fight extremely in Warcueid's favor. I just feel sorry for Neros in this matchup. However, that doesn't mean you can let your guard down around him. If he gets his zoo out, he is still a very difficult opponent to deal with. Keep the pressure up on him. Lead in with bloodrings as you attack him to make him afraid to throw out anti air attacks. Use j.2c to hit his high hitbox while he throws out his zoo. Something that screws over Nero Chaos even more in this fight is the fact that your 5a will hit him while he's crouching. Why is that a good thing? When blocked, your 5a recovers faster than the opponent stops blocking, allowing you to throw out a new attack with an advantage on your side. Again, Nero is a good matchup for Warcueid, but don't ever play defensively against him. Keep the pressure up on him.
Kohaku: See Maid Tag team. A fairly even matchup, but Kohaku alone has less mixups than the tag team combo in exchange for taking a little less damage and gaining some other moves which aren't worth noting.
Mech Hisui: A battle extremely in Mech Hisui's favor. Mech Hisui is the bane of Warcueid, so long as she utilizes her TK jetpack moves. She can throw out those jetpacks extremely fast, making it literally impossible for you to do any zoning from the air with your bloodrings. Which, of course, limits you to attacking from the ground, or jumping through the air while blocking hoping you break through a gap in Mech Hisui's own zoning to let you start pressure from the air up close. When Mech Hisui's put the fear of god (jetpacks) into you, she can limit your ground movement with her long range laser and missile attacks. Play extremely cautiously against Mech Hisui, don't zone with bloodrings unless she's showing a gap in her own zoning, and block, block, block and wait for openings in Mech Hisui's defense.
Necos: Who cares? If someone is actually trying to humiliate you with them, you'll find that with their hitboxes the spacing and timing for your combos is a lot less forgiving. Use j.a to keep launching them in the air during your combos if you need to. You can probably figure out how to dominate them yourself if you go against a Neco player.
Another Warcueid?: If you're fighting another Warcueid, try to maintain aeriel superiority. Don't throw out your normals against another one who's running out bloodrings against you. Zone and pressure her relentlessly if you get her into a corner, because a Warcueid doesn't have too many options against another one of her in that situation.
oh yeah and Arcueid: Another even match with Warc having an advantage. Arc has no specialized way of dealing with bloodrings but she doesn't have any serious weaknesses like Nero against her abilities. Arc is also a high damage/high defense character so you can't afford to show flaws in any zoning you do.

Thoughts?

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Red Arcueid / Warcueid infinite?

« on: December 22, 2007, 01:55:42 AM »

Looks like Warc pulls out what looks like an infinite on Aoko in this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsXc9BgKFJg

Starts at around 3:58.

I can't figure out for the life of me how to do this. It looks like he keeps SJ'ing into j.b, but I'm seeing three hits of j.b in it, so I'm thinking there might be an air dash cancel in there.

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Red Arcueid / Building Blockstrings as Warcueid

« on: December 13, 2007, 03:09:36 AM »

Heya, I just wanted to share the info about how I build blockstrings with Warc, hopefully to get criticism/comments about it so I can improve my own Warc game, and help other Warcs improve their play.

First, what is a blockstring? Its basically the moves you throw out on a person who's blocking to try to either make them guess wrong about your next move (high/low attack, throw, etc) so that they eat some damage, or to bait them to try to attack you when you actually have a move coming out with an advantage over the one they're throwing out. Also, I'm generally only talking about ground attacks in this, unless I specify otherwise. This writeup also assumes you have basic knowledge of how Warcueid's moves work, so if you aren't really familiar with the character, much of this writeup will probably not make much sense.

5a cancel
Of course, whiff canceling is important for nearly every member of the Melty Blood cast. Whiff canceling, in short, is canceling your current move into a move with quicker recovery (usually a normal into a 5a/2a that doesn't hit) so that you recover from a move you just threw out more quickly. Its very important for Warcueid, as she doesn't really have any command moves/normals by themselves that can give her an advantage on block (save for air attacks, of course).

So what's the deal on what to whiff cancel with for her? Well, first off, one important thing: you can cancel the recovery of a 5a/2a into an attack. This is very important for blockstrings. I'll get into that in a bit.

Now, all of Warcueid's normals, when they hit alone without canceling into something, they leave her at a disadvantage, meaning the recovery frames of the attack can be punished or her opponent will gain the initiative.

The most basic blockstring incorporating 5a for Warcueid is 5b2b5a. Its a fairly basic, effective blockstring: 5b moves her forward to her opponent and comes out fairly fast, 2b forces the opponent to crouch block or get hit, and the 5a will cancel the recovery frames of the blocked 2b, or continue launching the character if they didn't block the 2b. Plus, if 5b hits, you're already canceling into the next step of her combo, 2b. At that point, most players will know they've got the combo in, so they'll go with a 2c after the 2b instead of a 5a. In any case, if 2b gets blocked and 5a comes out, she is at neither an advantage or disadvantage frames wise with her opponent, which is a good thing if she has her opponent in the corner.

Other common cancels for 5a are immediately after a 5b. Though it doesn't force the opponent to block low, if they successfully block it, they are probably crouching anyways to block an anticipated low attack, so the 5a will whiff. If for some reason they don't block 5b and are hit by the 5a, you can shift the 5a into a 2b and continue comboing. Its another fairly effective attack that leaves Warcueid at neither an advantage or disadvantage frame wise.

After a 2c or 5c its fairly common for a Warcueid to cancel into 5a. At most ranges where you would strike out with a 5c or 2c rather than another attack you wouldn't be able to continue the combo anyways, so its natural to try to recover as fast as possible from the attack, regardless of whether your opponent blocks or is hit by the moves. An important thing to note: 5a canceling these moves immediately when they are blocked leaves Warcueid at a slight advantage. She recovers faster than her opponent finishes blocking.

Staggering blockstrings

What is staggering a blockstring? Instead of throwing out your blocked attacks as quickly as possible, you leave some space in between them, to bait an opponent to try to attack you. For example, the most common stagger is 5b, delay, 2b. It leaves a small gap of time where an opponent can throw out a 2a or another move. If they do throw out that move, it will most likely be counterhit by the Warc's 2b, as her 2b was already coming out when they tried to throw out their own move.

Staggering blockstrings is important for many characters. However, I feel that its not quite as important for Warcueid, as there's not really many normals she can do a full combo off of. You can stagger a 5c or a 2c and potentially hit the opponent during your blockstring, but they'll only be hit by that move, unless you cancel the move into an ex like 623c.

So, really, her main stagger comes down to 5b, delay, 2b. However, its not just as simple as delaying it for whatever duration of time you want. With a normal 5b, there is only a small amount of time where you can cancel the move into another before it becomes uncancellable. If you mistime it, you'll quickly find yourself in a tight spot, as a blocked 5b canceling into nothing leaves Warcueid at such a disadvantage that a 2a will usually hit her while she's recovering. However, the other forms of her 5b are much more lenient.

Warcueid's 5b, when fully charged, becomes an overhead. When half charged, its two hits instead of one. They both have more clashing frames than a normal 5b. Also, they are fully cancellable in all of the recovery frames. You are much more free to choose how to stagger a half charged 5b or a fully charged one.

Command moves
Command moves. They're very effective blockstring enders, her 214a especially.

214a. If it hits the opponent at point blank and they block it, Warcueid will be at a disadvantage. However, the longer the range at which the opponent blocks it, the less the disadvantage will be, almost nonexistent if your opponent has just blocked your 2c in a typical blockstring, due to the distance it usually pushes you back. 214a can be a good blockstring ender when you don't want to get a reverse beat penalty from 5a canceling or you don't have the cancel available. The animation is also very stealthy for the startup, so opponents will often try to jump when the bloodring comes out, hitting them during jump startup.

214b. No matter what range this starts from, it will leave Warcueid at a greater disadvantage than a blocked 214a. It also has longer startup than 214a, so if an opponent tries to immediately jump out after you end your blockstring prior to this move, they will probably avoid it entirely, and can probably punish you. Only use this move if you've got them scared of getting hit while trying to jump away. Though you don't want to throw out 214b too often, it can be very effective. If it DOES hit, you can cancel the move into 214c, then jump up and continue comboing the person for a decent amount of damage with an airthrow to bring them back down to the corner you had beaten them into. (only a few frames of 214b are cancellable into 214c, go into practice mode and play with the move to find out when you can do it)

214c. This is a good move to throw out when you're in full heat mode and have meter to burn. On block, it will leave you at an advantage over your opponent. If they block it in the air, they will be in blockstun for a short time after you've recovered, so you can hit them with an air unblockable move like 5c. Its also very difficult to shield (the opponent has to time each hit of the move).

236a. I like to call this move the 'Scrub Killer.' On block, it leaves you at a disadvantage and can be potentially punished if your opponent is in range to. If it whiffs, the same. The startup animation for this move is very stealthy, however. If your opponent likes to poke out or jump at you, it can be an effective string ender after a b move when you're fairly close to your opponent, or doing it after a 5a cancel. Generally, if an opponent's moves hit the flames this move summons up, they will be launched up into the air in a counterhit state, allowing you to combo them as you like. Use this move sparingly against good opponents, if a person isn't expecting it they will probably have trouble punishing it, but if a good opponent thinks you may throw this move out, they can probably deal with it and hurt you in return. However, if your opponent can't break a habit of trying to poke a move out of each blockstring you do, this move will destroy them, thus the name 'Scrub Killer.' The only time I've seen this fail against an opponent with that mindset was against a Shiki Tohno player, as his 2c would hit the flames and me at the same time, knocking me to the ground while he could tech back to his feet after taking minor damage.

236b. It has longer range than 236a, but it has a much longer startup. It also leaves you at a larger disadvantage than 236a on block. However, once the flames start coming out, you can freely cancel this move into any other ex move, meaning if a person gets tagged by the flames, you can probably continue the combo with a 214c, or if a person leaps over the flames, you can anti air them with 236c. That's honestly a very limited use, and 236b is very situational. You wouldn't hamper your play much if you never ever used this in a blockstring.

236c. Never use this in a blockstring. Its easy to see coming due to the superflash and it leaves you at a significant disadvantage if blocked.

How do these all fit together?

As mentioned before, 5a and 2a are cancellable in their recovery frames. Thus, if you do something like, 5b5a2b, your 2b has a very good advantage over the opponent, meaning if they try to throw out a hit or begin jumping (since they might anticipate you're only using your 5a as a neutral blockstring ender), they will probably be punished for it. However, this also means that your 5a has been used in the blockstring, so you can't cancel that 2b into a 5a, as you already canceled the 5b into into a 5a. Of course, you're free to cancel it into other moves, such as 236a, 214a, 2c, 2a, etc.

So, what's an example blockstring for Warcueid? Let's go with 5b5a2b, delay, 2c, 214a.
Let's analyze this. Your 5a canceling into a 2b leaves you at a significant advantage, meaning you'll hit your opponent if they they to throw out a normal move or jump away. The delay between the 2b and 2c may trick your opponent into thinking you've ended your blockstring, hitting them with 2c if they try to strike out or jump away. The 214a at the end returns you to a relatively neutral position initiative wise since by the time you throw it out there'll be enough distance between you and your opponent to let you mostly recover from the move when your opponent blocks it.

Don't just stick with a blockstring like this, however. Mix it up. If you just throw out the same thing over and over, a competent opponent will know what to expect, and they can counter it easily. For other examples of how to mix up your blockstring, you can cancel a 5b into a 5a, and after you finish recovering from 5a you can throw out an IAD j.b, forcing your opponent to block high. After a 5b2c5a, you can cancel the recovery frames into 2c, 214a, or another move instead of just using it to reset your blockstring. These are just examples. Use all of Warcueid's moves and build them into a variety of different blockstrings to keep your opponent paranoid, in the corner, and having to try to guess what you're going to do next.

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Akiha's Tea Room / So, who plays TF2?

« on: November 17, 2007, 07:12:21 PM »

If we got a few here who play TF2 I thought we could make a steam community for kicks.

That engineer's a spy!

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NetPlay Community / What not to do when netplaying

« on: September 10, 2007, 07:12:52 PM »

• Don't use a wireless connection.
• Don't run torrents while playing.
• Don't run a million programs in the background.
• Don't bitch about how you lost because of lag. Deal with it. Its just netplay. No one cares.
• Don't be HarmanSmith.

Thanks.

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Regional Community / Upper Midwest -- MN, WI, IA, IL, MI, etc

« on: February 28, 2007, 10:11:51 PM »

Any Melty Blood players up here in the ol' Midwest?

I should mention I'm from Minnesota.