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Atlas Academy => Melty Blood: Actress Again => Satsuki Yumizuka (Yumiduka) => Topic started by: Abstract Nonsense on October 23, 2008, 09:48:31 PM

When's Melty on Steam?
ahaha that's no--wait, what?
Title: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Abstract Nonsense on October 23, 2008, 09:48:31 PM
So yeah, we don't have this thread yet. Whywhywhy? Anyways, I don't know much about the  MBAA Sacchins*. Just that 214a is buffed, she's pressure and damage based with crazy combos, and is probably going to get nerfed in the next patch. Also, her only real 4way oki is now off of 623C sjdj. This is all I know. More stuff would be nice.


*Too busy netplaying.  :-[
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on October 23, 2008, 10:23:05 PM
According to almost every Japanese tier list so far, Sacchin is the worst character in the game.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Abstract Nonsense on October 23, 2008, 11:05:28 PM
According to almost every Japanese tier list so far, Sacchin is the worst character in the game.


 :emo:

I hope you are telling lies.

FMOON SACCHIN HAS ACTUAL GRAPPLE OPTIONS AND A REAL DASH. TAKE HEART MY MINISKIRTED BRETHEREN. ALL IS NOT LOST. EVEN WITHOUT OUR COVETED OKI WE SHALL BE MEDIOCRE!

Oh! Is j[C] air hit untechable, and if so how long are they down for? I think I have an idea.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: noradseven on October 24, 2008, 01:49:33 PM
According to almost every Japanese tier list so far, Sacchin is the worst character in the game.

W.Len and neko arcs are techically characters.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: ಠ_ಠ Dizzynecro on October 28, 2008, 09:13:12 PM
According to almost every Japanese tier list so far, Sacchin is the worst character in the game.

W.Len and neko arcs are techically characters.
:'(
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on November 03, 2008, 02:02:38 AM
Played a bit of Full Moon Sacchin today.

-DASH IS COMPLETELY CANCELLABLE.
-That uppercut thing is 623[A]. This makes that bnb people do this:

(j.C) 2A 5B (5C?) 2C 3C 623[A] j.[C] j.[C] dash 2C 3C 623[A] 421A/B

-Full moon's new 22A/B/C are very fast and have good range. 22C is much more consistent about beating out things than her old 22C.
-Her 214A can now be held. There's no spark, but you can delay it for a second. If held for long enough, she stops the attack. This is her "fake 214B" that we've seen in videos.

She looks solid. Crescent and full are pretty similar, only real differences are in their 5C and 22. Full moon's 5C looks like it has less combo use, but I don't know. Because of changed gravity, the timing on j.C feels really weird now. You have to do it earlier than you're used to doing it or it'll whiff since she falls so much faster. No more really close to ground j.Cs. No more airthrow blah blah blah mixups. Sacchin C needs to do the ghetto 623C mixups, Sacchin F can be more focused on guard break. 22B is a safe blockstring ender and 5[C] hurts guard quite a bit.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Alfonse on November 03, 2008, 03:48:20 AM
Her signature move is now the double bounce to corner rapefest courtesy of said BNB.  :psyduck:
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Abstract Nonsense on November 05, 2008, 12:44:17 PM
Her signature move is now the double bounce to corner rapefest courtesy of said BNB.  :psyduck:

Is that still going to be in the game after the update? It seems like something they'd be keen on removing.

 :emo:
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on November 08, 2008, 05:31:06 PM
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm5020799 3:30

My contribution:
http://ultima66.googlepages.com/IKUYOIKUYOEEEEE.mp3

Now someone kill me for doing that.  :emo:
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Abstract Nonsense on November 10, 2008, 12:54:16 AM

My contribution:
http://ultima66.googlepages.com/IKUYOIKUYOEEEEE.mp3

Now someone kill me for doing that.  :emo:

Are you actually some sort of tropical bird with a terminal illness?
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on November 30, 2008, 09:01:27 PM
Played a little crescent and full Sacchin today.

Crescent:
-Superjumps now don't make you "glide" any more. Your horizontal velocity drops about halfway through the jump or something. 22C no longer combos into j.[C].
-22A/B no longer have as many clash frames or something. I wasn't clashing when I should have been.
-236C has that "vaccuum" effect that 623C does. It's not unblockable, same in full moon.
-You have aerial EX Bite. Lol?

Full:
-May also apply to crescent, 236C damage seems up. 236C -> AAD does like 7000 while 623C -> AAD does like 6000 or less.
-Only 236 differences are she does a jump before the attack. 236C vaccuums but isn't unblockable, as said.
-I don't know if 3C 22A/B gives any advantage, but it's the best way to end blockstrings for full moon.
-I don't know if this is also for crescent or some weird thing happened, but I did 214C at point blank and it was blocked, which caused it to cross up like Warc 623C. It also seemed like it had less recovery.
-5B has less range, but it's not as bad as I thought. Same for 2A/5A. This means using it when you normally would might whiff, but at the same time, hitting with 5B will definitely be able to go into 2C for 2 hits and bnb rather than before where you sometimes only got 1 hit off 2C at longer ranges and couldn't do anything from it.

Both:
-Dash is not FULLY cancellable, as in if you do 66B really fast you'll only dash, but the uncancellable window is under 8 frames or something really short like that. You can essentially dash attack.
-214A can no longer be jump cancelled on block.
-I still don't know why the heck 623[A] sometimes grabs them and sometimes doesn't. At least when it grabs them you get some mixup potential and maybe you can OTG like off of 623B.
-3C can't be cancelled into normals. Essentially for crescent I don't know what you should be doing off of it when it's blocked. You can't whiff it, 214A can't be jump cancelled so it's disadvantageous, 22A/B are disadvantageous, 236B is punishable, 236A/C I think are disadvantageous, 623B/C both leave you worse off than just 3C does, and 623A/[A] tend to whiff and even when they don't they're disadvantageous. For full moon you get to 22A/B as a blockstring, but I don't know what you could do for crescent. I think cancelling into 214[A] also leaves you in a bad spot, but I'm not sure. If you're playing crescent, you should make all your blockstrings end in 2C 2/5A or 5C 2/5A I think, because I don't see what leaves you safe if you 3C.

She feels a lot more painful to play than she used to. It's not just oki that's missing now, but all of her blockstrings feel weaker and take more work apparently. Crescent airdodge gives some tricks and mixups, but for full moon, if the opponent blocks well, it feels like it's much harder to push in damage without using some crazy tricks. Facing out of the corner, you can get oki off of 2A 5B 2C 3C 623[B ] 2C 3C 623C 2C 3C 421B for what's essentially the same as her old bnb. The problem is you can't control what direction you throw them and it travels much further so you can do it out of the corner. If you aren't facing out of corner all you can do is try some tricks to land j.C or 2A and do her normal 2C 3C 623[A] j.[C] j.[C] 2C 3C 623[A] 421B and hopefully prioritize off of the frame advantage. Still, it's harder to land a hit than before and she was already the worst char at doing it.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on December 06, 2008, 09:59:07 PM
Lol Half Moon:

-j.A has more range than full moon, it's kinda a karate chop looking thing. Don't know if it's better or worse than Crescent j.A.
-5A is shorter than Crescent, but longer than Full. 2A is same as Full, the ground poke thing, it hits low.
-5B is same as MBAC. It actually has range.
-5C is same as Full, except it's cancellable like Crescent. It's pretty nice, makes it more useful than MBAC 5C outside of combos.
-236 is different from both other styles. Instead of hopping, she does a dash. 236A is a short dash, 236B is a really long dash where she's ducking down sort of, 236C is a short dash, comes out about as fast as MBAC 236C. Her 236B looks better, since it's like as fast as her old 236B but she moves forward a lot and she doesn't get hit by high attacks. Don't know if that makes it usable though.
-623A/B/C are like MBAC. No 623A uppercut, no chargeable 623A or 623B. Probably some startup/active/recovery data was changed, but in the other two styles 623 was changed drastically, in Half it's basically the same thing.
-214A/B can't be charged. They're the same as MBAC, except you still can't jump cancel 214A on block.
-No aerial EX bite in this style. It's crescent only.
-No dunk. She shares the same number of specials as MBAC, while the other two styles got extra specials.
-22A/B is same as Full... kinda. 22A is slow while 22B is fast. I think for some characters the designers switched around commands between A/B for no good reason, like Full Kouma has the same 22A/B as MBAC I think, but for Crescent 22A is the teleport and 22B is the attack. Regardless, I think 22B is like Miyako's 22A, and same use for ending blockstrings. 22A is slower, IIRC doesn't knock down, I think it's meant to be a stagger than you can combo out of.
-She has a "rolldodge." When you do it she floats forward. Also I don't know if this is Half only or Crescent and Half but using a Dodge weakens your guard bar, though only half as much as whiffing a shield would.
-j.B and j.C act like everyone else's j.B/C. Her j.C is weaker so she does less damage in Half than with any other style, but it seems like a much better move. It doesn't groundslam in air to air, so it sort of replaces j.B CH fishing, and it's jump/dash cancellable on hit and block. Yes, this means Half Moon actually has real pressure. She can do j.C ad. j.C or j.C 2C mixups that everyone else can. And I think this applies to every style, but it feels like j.C's hitbox was adjusted to reach behind her. I was getting j.C crossups a lot more in MBAA than the extremely rare j.C crossups I got in MBAC.

So Half Moon might actually be the best style, despite it becoming just another typical character. Meh. I have fun with it. If you really want, you can do damage loops with 2C 3C 5C 623B into OTG 623C like you could in MBAC. Her bnb from videos is 2A 5B 2B 3B 214A j.BC j.BC j.throw, but I think there's ways to optimize it past that.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Nightvoomer on January 23, 2009, 10:18:51 AM
Satsuki mixup video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1sg7yfT01k&feature=channel_page
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: kimjjo on January 23, 2009, 10:34:27 PM
Satsuki mixup video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1sg7yfT01k&feature=channel_page

Oh wow first update in a year, I had forgotten I even subscribed to him.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Abstract Nonsense on January 29, 2009, 09:53:53 AM
Satsuki mixup video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1sg7yfT01k&feature=channel_page

Sweet! It's not as ridiculous as the old one but at least it's something.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on February 05, 2009, 07:03:01 PM
So half moon is what it looks like. UFO has version A and I've been playing crescent again. j.[C] combo does less damage, but it's still a meterless option.

I've been messing around with old MBAC style combos, and I think you can get 4-way essentially all the time. I have to test though. 421B from behind midscreen gives the same 4-way setup as a low airthrow, but past midscreen it throws them into the corner. Coming off of 623C I've been doing 2C 5C 421B. Hopefully it's possible to do 623C dash under them as they bounce -> 421B to get the setup from anywhere. I was testing in MBAC and Sacchin has the stupid habit of doing what I would want her to do, except backwards. 66 623C if the opponent jumps over you mid dash gets read as 214C, except she's not smart enough to turn around and will punch away from the opponent unlike every other character. Also airdodge replaces 496 and has no execution requirement to do the exact same thing.

Half moon DOES have a really nice 22B. 22A is the staggered dust cloud that gives +f while 22B is the fast one that punishes a lot of things. It punishes backdashes really well since it's active for a long time and has about 1/3 screen reach.

236C has more reach also. It might have some uses, but I have no idea.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Benny1 on May 23, 2009, 10:34:39 AM
Does anybody know what H-Sacchin bnbs are?  I've seen people trying all sorts of different stuff but I'm not really sure if a consensus has been reached for what you're supposed to do.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on May 23, 2009, 11:12:33 AM
Does anybody know what H-Sacchin bnbs are?  I've seen people trying all sorts of different stuff but I'm not really sure if a consensus has been reached for what you're supposed to do.
I still use 2A 5B 2C 3C 214A j.BC j.BC j.throw or has there been a new bnb that people do now? I know I've seen a j.B land rejump combo but don't know it.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Benny1 on May 23, 2009, 12:57:17 PM
It's the j.B relaunch I'm interested in.  I saw it used a bit before, but I never seen it anymore.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: MK dagawd on May 23, 2009, 06:23:55 PM
  There is a relaunch off J.b if done really quick and correctly, its pretty neat.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: LordPangTong on May 31, 2009, 05:57:11 PM
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm7205237

Wow, even if it's against V Akiha, 7.7k damage combo at 11:48  :fap:
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on May 31, 2009, 06:31:22 PM
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm7205237

Wow, even if it's against V Akiha, 7.7k damage combo at 11:48  :fap:
She could always do almost that much damage with 236C. No one uses the combo because unless you spend 200% meter you don't get both damage and oki. It's better in MBAA because her meterless bnb is actually tolerable now and it builds more meter than she used to.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Masu on August 23, 2009, 09:34:29 PM
Does anybody know what H-Sacchin bnbs are?  I've seen people trying all sorts of different stuff but I'm not really sure if a consensus has been reached for what you're supposed to do.
Uhh.....I usually just do:
2B 2C 5B 5C jb jc djc throw 3247 dmg to chaos
6AAA 5C jb jc djc throw 2789 to chaos (pathetic, but meh.)
[jC] [jC] [5C] 623C 5C jb jc djc throw 4734 to chaos
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Abstract Nonsense on August 23, 2009, 10:26:55 PM
Alright, so I think I found out why people are having trouble with F Satsuki and C Satsuki's BnB. The real trick isn't getting the j[C] out early enough. I think there's actually a sort of minimum height imposed on the thing. What you want to focus on is jumping early enough when the 623[A] hit. That, for me at least, has made learning the thing much much easier.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on August 24, 2009, 01:41:33 AM
Does anybody know what H-Sacchin bnbs are?  I've seen people trying all sorts of different stuff but I'm not really sure if a consensus has been reached for what you're supposed to do.
Uhh.....I usually just do:
2B 2C 5B 5C jb jc djc throw 3247 dmg to chaos
6AAA 5C jb jc djc throw 2789 to chaos (pathetic, but meh.)
[jC] [jC] [5C] 623C 5C jb jc djc throw 4734 to chaos
Airstrings can be pretty complicated with relaunch and stuff, but for groundstring, you should pretty much always be doing any sort of confirm into 5B (2A 5B or j.C 5B, with 2B in there if you're close enough), and then depending on distance:

-(5C) 2C 3C 214A airstring, if you're too far omit 5C, works at any range you can confirm 5B
-5C 5A 6AA 2[C] 3C 214A airstring, needs to be varied for some characters, works close enough that 5C 5A will hit

The 5A 6AA combo doesn't work for Mecha Hisui, Vakiha, and Vsion, but you can make it work simply by not charging 2C. It will do less damage, but it's still the most useful high damage combo that can be done essentially anywhere. 2A 5BC 5A 6AA 2[C] 3C 214A j.BC j.BC j.throw does over 5000 damage to Nanaya easily, and j.C 5BC 5A 6AA 2[C] 3C 214A j.BC j.BC j.throw does something like 6300 damage on Warachia. For the airstring I don't know the relaunch combo but if you have trouble landing the first j.B you can j.AC j.BC for slightly less damage but it's easier, and I know for a fact j.BC j.BC ad. j.A j.throw works for a little extra damage. Magikarp9 also says off of j.C you can do 5A 6A 5B 2A 5A 6AA 2[C] etc, but that's a lot harder to do. First combo does 4098 on Nanaya off 2A, 4673 off j.C. Second combo does 5204 off 2A, 5945 off j.C.

Also C Sacchin has this little gem in the corner:

5[C] 2[C] 2C 3C 623[A] j.[C] j.[C] 2[C] 2C 3C 623[A] 623A

Meterless combo, very likely to get confirmed because it's off an overhead, and the damage is insane. This combo breaks 7000 damage on Vakiha, and around 6000 damage on most characters. It's also ridiculously hard to time the 2[C] 2Cs, so get practicing. The good thing though is that it's really easy to fake the overhead and just do 5{C} 2C and go into bnb off the 2C. Obviously the 623[A] 623A can be replaced by 623[A] 623C or 623[A] 421A/B if you want.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Abstract Nonsense on August 24, 2009, 12:45:10 PM
Quote
Obviously the 623[A] 623A can be replaced by 623[A] 623C or 623[A] 421A/B if you want.

Don't forget 5C 623C for the other corner mixup.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on August 24, 2009, 03:03:44 PM
Quote
Obviously the 623[A] 623A can be replaced by 623[A] 623C or 623[A] 421A/B if you want.

Don't forget 5C 623C for the other corner mixup.
Oh yeah you should 5C if you're not going to continue the combo after 623C. If you want more damage 3C 623[A] 623C 2C 3C 623[A] 421B probably does the most.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Abstract Nonsense on August 25, 2009, 11:21:10 AM
I just realized that 623[A] is a rather nice option select in pressure. Or at least I think it could be. Has anyone seen how well 623[A] works as option select pressure/AA? I think there may be a problem in that they could just poke during charge without repercussion.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Psylocke on November 03, 2009, 07:26:01 PM
Yuzuji, aka yuzupeko on Youtube, and the MBHP webmaster, just made a pretty big Satsuki video.  All styles featured, 18 mins
http://wikiwiki.jp/mbhp/?%B5%DD%C4%CD%A4%B5%A4%C4%A4%AD%A1%A1%A5%B3%A5%F3%A5%DC%A5%E0%A1%BC%A5%D3%A1%BC

Breakdown of video
Beginning - Full
4:15 - Half
9:45 - Crescent
14:02 - Random mixups for all moons
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Espard on November 03, 2009, 09:56:51 PM
Is it me... or is that video 880MB  :o.  With that 20kb/s download speed I get from Japan this could take a day  :slowpoke:.  Can anyone upload it to different site?  If not I'll just settle for a LQ version ripped from nicovideo  :-\  which BTW is 88 MB  :).
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Psylocke on November 04, 2009, 10:33:06 AM
sibla mirrored it on his Youtube, yay for old school director's accounts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHT7mmwSG3c
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Tempered on November 04, 2009, 12:49:06 PM
Wow. I never though to use 214b's super armor to counter shield counters. Too bad shes still vulnerable in the air to shields ;_;. Also new mixups i didnt think of using to mess around with.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on November 04, 2009, 12:59:09 PM
Charge 214B is clearly the best mixup.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Tiggy on November 08, 2009, 09:41:02 AM
sibla mirrored it on his Youtube, yay for old school director's accounts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHT7mmwSG3c

I only play H-Satsuki (haven't played F or C yet), but I saw some very interesting things in there.  One of the most interesting to me was the ability to combo into basketball bounce without having to start from 3[C].  I think one of the notations goes like:

Without jump-in (corner only)
2A 5B 5C 2C > 5A (whiff) 6AA > j.[C] dj.[C] > land > 2[C] 2C 5C > 623B

This doesn't work midscreen after doing some testing of my own; the 5A needed to whiff won't.  5A6A will hit, but the second 6A will whiff

And the fuzzy guard setups were really cool too.  Sorry if this is old news to anyone but it's new to me and I'm glad I was able to decipher any of it lol
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Tempered on November 08, 2009, 02:47:42 PM
You got the notation right, but probably the spacing wrong. You need to hit a certain distance with 2c so that 5a will whiff and both 6aa's will hit, which is hard, and I think doesnt work on every character.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Benny1 on November 08, 2009, 03:10:53 PM
It can help to sub 2B instead of 5B, 5B has a large amount of forwards movement, 2B has none iirc.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Tiggy on November 09, 2009, 02:53:06 PM
Thanks for the input gaiz

After a little more testing, I found the non-3[C] basketball combo doesn't work on Sion at all, and it's fucking ridiculously hard on Kohaku, at least the 2[C] 2C ender.  Her hitbox is retarded.  At least you can do it midscreen to Kohaku.  I'll edit this post with the vid, but here's the one I made VS VAkiha:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wY8iwSIyOC0

EDIT:
Here's the combo VS Kohaku:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJjojyohCCQ&fmt=18

Ok, tested on more characters:

Shiki: Possible midscreen/corner
Warachia: He was kinda weird; I could do it off of dash in 2A 2B 5C 2C or 2B starter only in the corner
Arc: I got 5A (whiff) 6AA once on her
Miyako: Timing/Spacing is very very strict, I believe I got it from 2A 2B 5C 2C midscreen
Chaos: Not possible
Warc: I got it off of j.C > dj. dj.B fuzzy guard once in the corner, don't remember the ground string  :(
Ciel: 2A 2B 5C 2C midscreen, 2A 5B 5C 2C corner

So far, only VAkiha, Kohaku, Ciel and Shiki seem to have the only reasonable timing out of the chars I tested

Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Tonberry on December 15, 2009, 12:50:54 AM
I didn't see this posted anywhere in here so: http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm8797833

Looks like FSacchin tutorial vid.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Asaemon on December 25, 2009, 10:57:32 AM
Can anyone help me? i need bnb's s and mix up for h-satsuki.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on December 25, 2009, 11:08:30 AM
Combos are on the wiki. For pressure you want to get them into the corner and force them to do something risky to get out. 2A hits low and Half has a really fast dash, so dash 2A is better than for C/F. 5C can catch jumps and 5[C] takes off a ton of guard bar, and both of them can be rebeated. 22A is great at forcing them to block because of very short recovery, 22B is comboable on hit or if they jump out. She doesn't really have an overhead, and you shouldn't use 214B/236B, but when they're in the corner it shouldn't matter. You can force people to mash/jump/guard break. Satsuki also has one of the best ways to punish jump outs with 623C and she has a command grab.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Asaemon on December 25, 2009, 11:34:04 AM
Thank you, but could you post the link to her wiki.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on December 25, 2009, 02:26:42 PM
http://mbaa.mizuumi.net/index.php/Main_Page

Characters in the side bar.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: noradseven on December 28, 2009, 09:55:05 PM
Im just going to leave this here its Japanese but I don't know any Japanese and with google translator lol, and some basic knowing what what is I figured all of it out.

Styles are on side bar, they got almost nothing for cresent, but alot of the stuff in full can be applied to cresent a well plus they got some cool vid links.

I am really interested in that 623[A],j.[C],j.[C],IAD,j.B,/\,5B,623[B ], 2AAA,2C,623C I see I don't know why its done. I have been using the F moons, dunk combo to 623C,dash 2[C] 623[B ], 236[A]/236[B ] mixup fucking hilarious.

http://wikiwiki.jp/satukiss/?FrontPage
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Veven on January 03, 2010, 04:38:11 PM
I tested that 5A whiff 6AA j.{C} combo on a few characters. The results have been sitting in a txt file for a while, so I figured I'd post it. I couldn't land the combo  on Shiki, but Tiggy said he could. Turns out my game was set on arcade balance. After switching to original balance, it worked on Shiki. I don't want to re-test everyone, so the following characters work with arcade balance, but possibly not original. Also, I didn't get to testing it on the Maids, and some others, so this isn't comprehensive.

Kouma
-mid   dash 5B 5C 2C   (cancel into 5A exactly as the second hit of 2C lands)
-corner   IAD j.C, 2A 5B 2C
-corner   (dash) 2A 5B 2C

Ciel
-mid   dash 5B 5C 2C
-mid   dash 2AB 5C 2C
-corner   dash 2AB 5C 2C
-corner   IAD j.C, 2B 2C

Warachia
-mid   (dash) 2A 5B 2B 2C
-corner   IAD j.C 2B 2C
-corner IAD j,C, 2AA 5B 2C

Roa   easy
-mid   2A 5B 2B 2C
-mid   IAD j.C, 2A 2B 2C
-corner   2A 5B 2C
-corner   IAD j.C, 2A 5B 2C

Arc   
-mid   (dash) 5B 5C slight delay 2C
-corner no, but dash 5B 2B 2C is so close

Warc
-mid   IAD j.C 5B 5C 2C
-corner dash 2A 5B 2B 2C

V Akiha
-corner   (dash) 2A 5B 5C 2C
-corner   IAD j.C 5B 5C 2C
-mid   (dash) 2A 5B 2B 2C

Mech   easy
-corner   (dash) 2A 5B 5C 2C
-corner   IAD j.C 2A 5B 2C
-mid   (dash) 2A 5B 2B 2C
-mid   IAD j.C 2A 5B 2C

There are actually quite a few different opening strings and spacings that work on each character. The timing and delay between button presses is important, since, for example, delaying one or two frames between 5C and 2C is the difference between getting the optimal distance and dropping the combo.

However, on some characters, the actual difficulty in landing the combo isn't the spacing, but the timing of the 5A 6AA after 2C. Sometimes it works if you mash 6AAA after the first hit of 2C, and other times it only works if you delay slightly until the second hit of 2C. I think it has to do with the way each character's hit box changes when hit with 2C. Since it's a quick 2 hits, the character goes through two very fast hit-box animations. Depending on exactly when you cancel into 5A determines what part of the animation they're in. I don't know MB frame data well enough, but I would think it has something to do with a hit-stun style animation stop, at least on the part of the receiving character. In other words, I think that for some characters the only way to whiff 5A at the proper distance is to hit it during the first few frames (possibly the very first) of the second hit of 2C's hit-stop.

I picked H Satsuki because of the easier execution requirements relative to F or C, but I enjoy looking at combos like this and figuring out how they work. Anyways, I don't think it's practical, I've only seen it tried in one match video, I think, against Warachia, and it whiff failed.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Ultima66 on January 03, 2010, 08:17:46 PM
The difference between first and second hit 2C is that first hit doesn't sweep while second hit sweeps. It's not anything about different frames of recoil. After a sweep, the first 2 hits of 5A 6AA will send the opponent higher. If they don't get swept, the first 2 hits won't.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Tonberry on January 01, 2011, 09:07:11 PM
A couple of interesting j[c] mixups are showcased in this vid

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm13174543

Last clip is gdlk too
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: academico on January 02, 2011, 10:36:57 AM
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm5020799 3:30

My contribution:
http://ultima66.googlepages.com/IKUYOIKUYOEEEEE.mp3

Now someone kill me for doing that.  :emo:

WTF!
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: TrueGunnerShadow on May 18, 2011, 05:39:02 PM
A couple of interesting j[c] mixups are showcased in this vid

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm13174543

Last clip is gdlk too

I agree as well.
I'm curious though, Is that Mixup Legit?
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Tonberry on May 18, 2011, 06:05:03 PM
A couple of interesting j[c] mixups are showcased in this vid

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm13174543

Last clip is gdlk too

I agree as well.
I'm curious though, Is that Mixup Legit?

The first clips in black and white are all not mixups.  The j[c] into sandoori and j[c] jc fuzzy IH jc mixups are both legit.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Espard on May 19, 2011, 07:30:56 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CK_i7Lr5CXQ&t=8m43s
What have they done...
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: BurstOfAnger on May 20, 2011, 05:21:30 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CK_i7Lr5CXQ&t=8m43s
What have they done...

O.O

But why did the last airgrab miss? I'm guessing due to the madly increased gravity from so many hits. At least she's limited from making it infinite from the cost of 50% meter per cancelled airdodge. Nanaya's meter didn't increase at a faster rate eventhough the number of hits far exceeded 20. I thought in MBAA, hits more than 20 will greatly increase the enemy's meter?

EDIT: Okay, Nanaya's rate of meter gain did greatly increase from the 30th hit onward. My bad. Did the number of hits change from 20 to 30?
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Tonberry on May 20, 2011, 09:05:37 AM
It was always ~30 where meter starts shooting up.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Rokunaya on May 20, 2011, 11:27:54 AM
tbh this combo seems like a waste of meter
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: BurstOfAnger on May 20, 2011, 03:48:46 PM
It was always ~30 where meter starts shooting up.

Thanks for the clarification.

tbh this combo seems like a waste of meter

It absolutely is. Loops are done to generate meter, not burn it. But it is indeed flashy and useful to just stall time.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: TrueGunnerShadow on May 31, 2011, 05:49:47 PM
Your right on the money there.
This is just meant to be a Satsuki players can be show off. lol.
I can understand if it's for the win.
But no.
Title: Re: Sacchin Actress Again
Post by: Axis on September 28, 2011, 10:48:29 AM
So anyone got a link to the Satsuki changes?