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Atlas Academy => Melty Blood: Current Code => Shiki Ryougi => : CPhame January 01, 2012, 09:56:12 PM

When's Melty on Steam?
ahaha that's no--wait, what?
: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 01, 2012, 09:56:12 PM
Starting a new thread dedicated to Half moon style Ryougi.  She's a little worse for the wear, but still versatile and stuff and stuff.

Changes to 1.07:

+ 5A is now one frame faster (6 frames).
+ 2B is now two frames faster (9 frames).
+ 63214B has faster startup.
+ Crouching picks up knife automatically in neutral state.
+ 22A_B_C manual knife pick up command now has less recovery frames.
+ 236A 236A 236C rekka ender is now EX cancelable.
+ 236C now has two additional invincibility frames on startup (7 frames).
+ 236C and 623C can OTG after untechable knockdown.


- 2C now has two less active frames (14-16 frames).
- 4C is now two frames slower (27 frames).
- j.A hitbox slightly smaller.
- j.B hitbox reduced in size, one frame slower (8 frames).
http://i.imgur.com/3VFms.png (http://i.imgur.com/3VFms.png)
- j.6B hitbox reduced in size, one frame slower (8 frames).
http://i.imgur.com/VkcOY.png (http://i.imgur.com/VkcOY.png)
- j.C hitbox reduced in size.
http://i.imgur.com/T8JtV.png (http://i.imgur.com/T8JtV.png)
- 236A character hitbox increased slightly.
- 214A lands outside of corner during combos.
- 41236C Arc Drive is now escapeable after super flash.
- Overall health reduced to 11416 points (PS2 level).
- Rising rate now slower, increased to 15 frames.
http://bit.ly/x1vLI7 (http://bit.ly/x1vLI7)


Feel free to add any more data on additional changes.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LivingShadow January 01, 2012, 10:07:11 PM
Here's Fusui's H-Ryougi: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xlAYiSAvAE

H-Ryougi has way better options off of the j.22c ender.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 01, 2012, 10:16:27 PM
Oh man, and I was JUST about to make a thread myself (and for F as well) Hahaha

So anyways, I think 2C is alot slower now? TK-ing j.236B after 2C seems to have this awkward timing to it but it's still doable.
Also, no 3C loop :'(
I don't think you can combo 623B from 3C now. Still have to check properly.

As far as corner combos go I did a quick one here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35zrS4a-ev0

I think I can do more damage though, after j.B whiff 2C 3C 22A probably can work and could also add a 623B in there as well. Now to find the most optimal midscreen bnb :V
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 01, 2012, 10:44:33 PM
I've been watching those Fusui vids.  Really excellent work.  I've never really used 6AA that much in Actress Again, and from what I've heard, it's a much better anti-air device than before.  That's something she needed quite badly, imo.

Nice combo, Weika. I was worried Ryougi couldn't break 5k off of her regular corner combos anymore. Thanks for dispelling that myth.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Greg January 02, 2012, 12:16:36 AM
After maining h-ryougi for the past year and a half... I can't say I'm happy with what I've seen so far.

The 214A and 2C changes both suck hard. Pointlessly destroyed our old combos.

Good ol' (2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c tk236b 5bb 214a 2c 5c 22a 2c 3c 623b 236a 236a 236a) doesn't work anymore.

For whatever reason there's a weird space behind them when you 214A that makes you 2C in the opposite direction from MBAA. I still haven't figured out the circumstances exactly but depending on your timing (and I guess distance away from your opponent?) 2C may also decide to go the direction she used to go, so maybe you can get her to go the right direction with the right timing? Regardless, Not fun.

I can't tell if 2C is that much slower. I personally didn't have any problems combo'ing tk236b after it but the hitbox is definitely definitely significantly lower. You can't use the same timing you used for catching people with it in knife combos as you did in MBAA. The timing definitely feels tighter (gayer). 

I'm suddenly having a lot more trouble landing the knifeless midscreen rejump combo. I think they might have toned down the top of the hitbox on her JC but I'm not really sure. It may just be the new buffer fucking me up.

4c definitely feels slower. I'd say it feels about the speed of an average overhead now as opposed to an extremely fast one. I haven't actually looked at the frame data.

Ryougi does look like she has some better oki options off of a j22c ender but it still kinda seems like a waste of meter unless you want to burn meter to avoid going into heat. They can tech once they hit the ground so you need to tag them with a 2c before they land to get untechable knockdown. It doesn't really give her any new options because you simply could have done a ground combo that resulted in untechable knockdown and comparable oki. I guess you could try and create some sort of tech trap thing but, given a choice between untechable and techable knockdown.. I think I'd rather make sure that my opponent stays in the corner.

The new speed on the 63214 series was definitely needed to make the moveset more viable but it's still super retarded. I can't really in good conscience say that I think any of these will show themselves to be a useful tool. 63214a, the only marginally useful one is kinda just a bad 22a without the plus frames.

As for her health.... It's not any higher than it was in console. Her health was buffed for 1.05 but they nerfed it back down to around where it was originally for 1.07. When you consider the fact that she now has her old health back but lost what I think is in relation to the rest of the cast comparatively significant damage on all of her combos, it really does not leave her in good shape. Her low health was forgivable before because her damage was extremely formidable and her meter gain from the sweep loop made her significantly less mushy, however, now that she's lost both of those things, her health is crippling and retarded.

Positives:
*She has a strong reversal (22c)
*She has long normals with retarded clash frames

Negatives:
*She has no health
*She has mediocre damage
*Her normals have terrible recovery
*She has no mixup
*She lacks reliable tools (aka most of her specials side towards gimmicky or useless)
*She has no health

So, I've come to a point in my Melty career where I need to re-evaluate this character and decide whether or not to reinvest time into learning her new shit. Sadly,  I don't really think I can find a compelling reason to continue to play her. There are other characters that can simply do all the things that H-Ryougi does and they don't bleed nearly as much for it.  If anyone wants to point out the giant gaping holes in my arguments, go ahead.  :emo:


Nice combo, Weika. I was worried Ryougi couldn't break 5k off of her regular corner combos anymore. Thanks for dispelling that myth.
He used 100% meter and it was on Ryougi (Psss... She has no defense!)

I don't think you can combo 623B from 3C now. Still have to check properly.
It still works fine.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: MasaBlade January 02, 2012, 12:42:41 AM
^I think you went a little overboard lol. you make it sound like she's a garbage character right now and she's really not. if you really liked the character you wouldnt mind learning her new stuff; it'll be just as rewarding.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 02, 2012, 12:53:00 AM
I didn't realize they nerfed her health.  Do you have a source?  And do you happen to know how much health Ryougi had in 1.05?  I crunched the numbers and came out with 11488 health (she had 11416 in the PS2 version). 

That's fucking sad.

Regardless, I don't think she's a glass cannon anymore.  More like a glass pistol.  That does hardly any damage.  Which is also sad, because that was the thing that made her worth playing.

I do agree with the point that you have to use meter more often now with her combos. The induction of j22C and OTG 236C prove it. Unfortunately it seems like her bread and butter combos give less meter now, and when you couple that fact with her wonky combos now...you get the picture.

2C doesn't feel slower to me.  It just feels like the hit box changed up.  I did notice after an hour's worth of training mode practicing tk236B > BB > 236B etc combo that if I delayed the tk motion and BB input, 2C hit the correct way.  Seems way too tight of a combo now, and equally risky if they can tech out of it.  No bueno.

On the plus side, 5A>6A is better, her air throw is comboable, and knife mind games are much, much better.  Even though it's early, I'd stick H-Ryougi at B tier, low A tier for what it's worth.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 02, 2012, 01:22:18 AM
Who has the highest defense btw?

I used Ryougi due to her weird hitbox, if it works on her then that's good for me. I just tested the same combo on Kouma, Ciel, Nero and a few others. Dmg is around 4.6-9k, probably gonna be ~4.3k when fully mashed.

EDIT: Fusui is awesome, why haven't I seen this guy sooner. :psyduck:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LivingShadow January 02, 2012, 07:03:53 AM
Who has the highest defense btw?

I used Ryougi due to her weird hitbox, if it works on her then that's good for me. I just tested the same combo on Kouma, Ciel, Nero and a few others. Dmg is around 4.6-9k, probably gonna be ~4.3k when fully mashed.

EDIT: Fusui is awesome, why haven't I seen this guy sooner. :psyduck:
Highest defense is Akiha.

I think Fusui usually plays C-Aoko, but he did rather well with H-Ryougi.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Greg January 02, 2012, 10:29:33 AM
I didn't realize they nerfed her health.  Do you have a source?  And do you happen to know how much health Ryougi had in 1.05?  I crunched the numbers and came out with 11488 health (she had 11416 in the PS2 version). 

There was an updated defense value chart floating around IRC.

Her defense values in PS2 were:
1.05,1 ,.95, .95
Pretty sure 1.05 was:
1.05, .97, .89, .86
They're now:
1.05, 1.02, 0.98, 0.95

On the plus side, 5A>6A is better, her air throw is comboable, and knife mind games are much, much better.  Even though it's early, I'd stick H-Ryougi at B tier, low A tier for what it's worth.
Air throw being combo-able is a universal change.

^I think you went a little overboard lol. you make it sound like she's a garbage character right now and she's really not. if you really liked the character you wouldnt mind learning her new stuff; it'll be just as rewarding.

She's not garbage, she's just really unremarkable. If you want to stick with her because you have character love, you'll probably do alright. But if you want to pick a character that has a lot to offer, I'd probably start looking elsewhere.

I also completely forgot to rant about her arc-drive changes as well. No longer does she have her awesome tick ex command throw arc drive thing, it's just the same old knife user arc drive. It's so easy to jump out of it makes me :emo:. I don't want to just yell USELESS!!! without actually trying to hit people with it but... come' on...

According to Livingshadow, Ryougi also has a normal wake up speed now.

She's just not nearly as interesting or as gay as she used to be.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 03, 2012, 02:16:38 AM
Found a better corner combo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bk-3J9le17M

First off, it's basically the same combo but with 22A and another 5C 5BB. Also, you gain more heat so that's better.

As I said earlier, after j.B(w) you can land > 3C into 623A/B or rekka for oki (haven't tested them out yet, but it should be possible.

This can easily reach 5K+ on characters w/good defense with j.C starter.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Charby January 03, 2012, 09:13:24 AM
Actualy i do think the best combo in corner regarding oki is this one:
2A 5BB 2B 5C 2C TK 236B 5BB 214A 5A 22A 3C 623B 2C 3C 623C
And for the midscreen it's something like that without ex:
2A 5BB 2B 5C 2C 236A 236A 214A
And with the 22C In air something like this.
2A 5BB 2B 5C 2C 6AA JB JC JB JC 22C 2C 3C 623B 623A

Ending with airthrow is realy bad.

All shown in the fusui vid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xlAYiSAvAE
 
And now 63214A is frame positive so you can 63214A 2A for example in pressing
I just cant get any of this done yet...
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 03, 2012, 11:18:18 AM
Found a better corner combo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bk-3J9le17M

First off, it's basically the same combo but with 22A and another 5C 5BB. Also, you gain more heat so that's better.

As I said earlier, after j.B(w) you can land > 3C into 623A/B or rekka for oki(haven't tested them out yet, but it should be possible.)

This can easily reach 5K+ on characters w/good defense with j.C starter.

Yeah... :V
Besides, it does more damage too.

I'm testing out the best midscreen combo, with oki atm. Will post it later.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 04, 2012, 11:26:28 AM
I did some digging. Turns out 2C has two less active frames than the PS2 version.  That might explain why the timing is so weird now on tk236B combos.

On another topic, does anyone know a meterless combo that breaks 5k? (and gives good oki)
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 04, 2012, 05:16:50 PM
I did some digging. Turns out 2C has two less active frames than the PS2 version.  That might explain why the timing is so weird now on tk236B combos.

On another topic, does anyone know a meterless combo that breaks 5k? (and gives good oki)

Ahh, figured. You can definitely feel the reduction in active frames for 2C, even more after doing 214A into 2C in the corner, timing is pretty tight.

meterless combo, with oki and 5K... hmm that's pretty hard lol. Unless it's on a low defense character and is a j.C starter then I guess it's possible.

Welp, corner only: j.C 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C TKj.236B 5BB 214A 2C 5C 22A 3C 236A 236A 236A does 5.4K on VSion lol.

Also, best midscreen, meterless oki combo imo: 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 236A 236A 236A does 3.7K on Akiha.

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: BurstOfAnger January 05, 2012, 05:32:35 AM
I did some digging. Turns out 2C has two less active frames than the PS2 version.  That might explain why the timing is so weird now on tk236B combos.

On another topic, does anyone know a meterless combo that breaks 5k? (and gives good oki)

Would that be two active frames less in the beginning or the end of the move?
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 05, 2012, 07:29:00 AM
Startup is the same at 14 frames, but only lasts until frame 16.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Ichipoo January 05, 2012, 08:42:54 AM
So in a nutshell, can anybody explain how H is different from C? And if any, what reasons would you say one would choose H over C?

/curious
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Numakie January 05, 2012, 08:59:23 AM
So in a nutshell, can anybody explain how H is different from C? And if any, what reasons would you say one would choose H over C?

/curious

I like Knife gimmicks and her 3C sweep.
Being half moon is a plus too. Can't go too crazy with meter though cuz she needs all the life she can get.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LivingShadow January 05, 2012, 09:07:47 AM
H-moon advantages:
Half auto counter
Half auto burst
Can catch the knife out of the air
Can pick up knife just by crouching
better range on 5c
blockstrings are tighter

C-moon advantages:
Max mode/ controlled meter
5 unblockables
421 series
AAD
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Greg January 05, 2012, 11:38:11 AM
The real reason to pick H is the knife. She has the best move set with it out of any moon and given that she can catch it in the air or pick it up without inputting 22x, it gives you something substantial to work with against zoners. How important that is to you, you'll have to decide. The other moons, especially F now, are probably better otherwise.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LivingShadow January 05, 2012, 11:46:48 AM
I will maintain that H has better blockstrings than C. C has to rely on delays and unblockables while H has a legit overhead.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 05, 2012, 12:21:02 PM
Don't forget that H moon has the best set of frame traps and ground normals.  Except for air-to-ground normals. She really suffers from that.

Combo damage is on par / slightly less than F moon with tighter execution.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Charby January 05, 2012, 03:30:04 PM


Also, best midscreen, meterless oki combo imo: 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 236A 236A 236A does 3.7K on Akiha.

This is slighty better
2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 623A (Knife Pickup)
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 05, 2012, 05:31:42 PM


Also, best midscreen, meterless oki combo imo: 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 236A 236A 236A does 3.7K on Akiha.

This is slighty better
2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 623A (Knife Pickup)

Yeah, that's better actually. Leaves you really close to the knife so you can pick it up again. Rekka version does a little bit more damage but you have to IADB to pick it up.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Theta Sigma January 07, 2012, 03:06:37 PM


Also, best midscreen, meterless oki combo imo: 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 236A 236A 236A does 3.7K on Akiha.

This is slighty better
2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 623A (Knife Pickup)
after 22A i can't connect 2C...always miss

I have been playing for a while and the "Fusui Corner combo" i miss the part of 5A-22A-3C...can someone explain me the correct timming?

but well in the corner i found this combo:

2A 5BB 5C 2C tk.j236B 5BB 214A (Land) J.BC 22C (Land)3C 623B 623A.

it's not the best option i know it...but works for me.

PD: Can someone explain why 2A 2B? I'm always doing 2A 5BB

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Pincher January 07, 2012, 06:39:08 PM
PD: Can someone explain why 2A 2B? I'm always doing 2A 5BB

2b 5bb prorate is better you get more damage for the combo than doing 5bb 2b
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 07, 2012, 08:24:35 PM


Also, best midscreen, meterless oki combo imo: 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 236A 236A 236A does 3.7K on Akiha.

This is slighty better
2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 2C 3C 623B 2C 623A (Knife Pickup)
after 22A i can't connect 2C...always miss

I have been playing for a while and the "Fusui Corner combo" i miss the part of 5A-22A-3C...can someone explain me the correct timming?

but well in the corner i found this combo:

2A 5BB 5C 2C tk.j236B 5BB 214A (Land) J.BC 22C (Land)3C 623B 623A.

it's not the best option i know it...but works for me.

PD: Can someone explain why 2A 2B? I'm always doing 2A 5BB

Who did you test it on? After 22A just immediately do 2C into 3C, it connects so far on most of the cast. It you can connect it just do 22A 3C instead.

I think you need to land, walk back a bit and then 5A 22A for the Fuusui corner combo version.

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 07, 2012, 11:52:58 PM
Well I think I finally found it.  It needs a j.C to hit over the 5k mark though (total damage 5511 on F Nanaya).

j.C 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C j.236B > 5A 22A > 2C 3C 6AAA 214A > j.BC > dj.BC air throw

It's really easy to pull off compared to the Fuusui knife-pick up combo (which I just completely went past).  I can't get the timing for the life of me since it's so ridiculously tight.  That particular combo goes something like this:

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C j.236B > 5A 22A > 2C 3C (pick up knife) 2A 5A 22A > 5C 3C 6AAA > etc

Probably worth the damage, but not worth the trouble unless you're a combo professional (or Japanese). 

Other combos that I've been working with include:

(midscreen)

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 5A 22A > 2C 3C 623B > 623 C > 2C 5C 5BB > j.BC dj. BAC 236B

For some characters like V. Sion you don't need to do 623C, as another 2C will hit again fairly easily after the first 623B.  Don't know why it works like that, it just does.  I think it works on Satsuki and Akiha too.  Might have to test it again.

If you don't have the meter to spend or a knife to throw, you can use two alternative midscreen combos.  The damage on both is around 3.8k and leaves you and the other person in two different situations: a forced knockdown, or against the wall. 

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 236A 236B (cross under) 214A

This one gives a forced knockdown.  Follow up with j.236B for lulzy which-way guessing games.  You can also continue it with 236C > air combo if you feel like finishing them off, since that OTGs.

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 6AAA > j.BC > dj. BAC 236B

This one pushes to the wall, but has no forced knockdown.  It does more damage, however, as a simple staple.  Use at your own discretion.  You can forgo 236B for 22C if you have the meter to extend the combo with 2C 3C > whatever for another forced knockdown. 

And lastly, I'm hearing stories on 2ch that people are getting fed up with all the Full moon Ryoug players and are beginning to focus their attention on Half, lol.  Someone discovered a knife pickup throw loop too.  I won't believe it until I see it in a video though.  Might be too good to be true.  But if it is true...
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 08, 2012, 02:43:59 AM
Good stuff CPhame. I'm starting to use alot of 5A 22A after tk now too myself.

I noticed you can pick up the knife after 3C tk j.236B in the corner. For example: 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22A 3C j.236B If you delay the tk she picks the knife again which looks pretty cool but I've yet to find a use to it. (5A tends to high pretty high after the tk so it's pretty hard to follow up with 22A) Problem is, I think knife prorates alot so it might not be as helpful.

Oh man, knife pickup loop would be hype as hell. :fap:

Hmmm, I didn't know about 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C j.236B > 5A 22A > 2C 3C (pick up knife) 2A 5A 22A > 5C 3C 6AAA > etc Seems fairly easy, I'll test it on more characters and see if it's char specific.

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Theta Sigma January 08, 2012, 04:07:49 AM
I test all of my combos and things on Archetype Earth.

Any good blockstring? my blockstring is a meter waste
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 08, 2012, 12:07:36 PM
Here's a lulzy midscreen combo.

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C tk.j236B (land) 22C BE623B 2C 3C 623B 623A

other variations after BE623A:

-5C j.BC j.BC AT/j.236B
-2C 3C 5A6AA 214A j.BC j.BC AT/j.236B

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9bmuSLiXjAk

It's not really worth it (100 meter and knife is pretty far) so yeah :nyoro:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LuminAbyss January 08, 2012, 02:05:19 PM
I personally can't seem to get the 5A 22A to connect after TK 236B. Is it just hilarious tight, or character specific, or what? ; __ ;
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 08, 2012, 04:32:16 PM
Just got around to playing around with Ryougi in CC. Wanted to mention that for her corner combo, you can still set up mix-ups after her corner combo.

2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c tkj.236b 5bb 214a 2c 2a/421c -> mix-up

After the 214a, if you just stay still, or walk away from the corner and 2c, you will 2c into the corner. If you walk towards the corner, you will 2c away from the corner. This can be useful for mix-up.

If you 2c'd into the corner, you are very close to them, so you can do a neutral jump mix-up.

If you 2c'd away from the corner, you can do a roll mix-up, or you can super jump into a 3-way.

The knockdown from 2c 2a feels shorter in CC though, though that could be my imagination.

Edit: Also wanted to mention that you can still do:

2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c tkj.236b 5bb 214a (walk towards corner) 2c 5c 22a 2c 623b 236a236a236a
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Rei January 08, 2012, 04:35:47 PM
Just got around to playing around with Ryougi in CC. Wanted to mention that for her corner combo, you can still set up mix-ups after her corner combo.

2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c tkj.236b 5bb 214a 2c 2a/421c -> mix-up

After the 214a, if you just stay still, or walk away from the corner and 2c, you will 2c into the corner. If you walk towards the corner, you will 2c away from the corner. This can be useful for mix-up.

If you 2c'd into the corner, you are very close to them, so you can do a neutral jump mix-up.

If you 2c'd away from the corner, you can do a roll mix-up, or you can super jump into a 3-way.

The knockdown from 2c 2a feels shorter in CC though, though that could be my imagination.

Sadly it's also character specific on where opponents go after 214A. they all have different wall bouncing hitboxes.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 08, 2012, 04:46:19 PM
Just got around to playing around with Ryougi in CC. Wanted to mention that for her corner combo, you can still set up mix-ups after her corner combo.

2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c tkj.236b 5bb 214a 2c 2a/421c -> mix-up

After the 214a, if you just stay still, or walk away from the corner and 2c, you will 2c into the corner. If you walk towards the corner, you will 2c away from the corner. This can be useful for mix-up.

If you 2c'd into the corner, you are very close to them, so you can do a neutral jump mix-up.

If you 2c'd away from the corner, you can do a roll mix-up, or you can super jump into a 3-way.

The knockdown from 2c 2a feels shorter in CC though, though that could be my imagination.

Sadly it's also character specific on where opponents go after 214A. they all have different wall bouncing hitboxes.

Well, that's new... Are there specific characters that are good for testing on? Or do I actually need to go through the whole cast?
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Rei January 08, 2012, 05:35:19 PM
Just got around to playing around with Ryougi in CC. Wanted to mention that for her corner combo, you can still set up mix-ups after her corner combo.

2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c tkj.236b 5bb 214a 2c 2a/421c -> mix-up

After the 214a, if you just stay still, or walk away from the corner and 2c, you will 2c into the corner. If you walk towards the corner, you will 2c away from the corner. This can be useful for mix-up.

If you 2c'd into the corner, you are very close to them, so you can do a neutral jump mix-up.

If you 2c'd away from the corner, you can do a roll mix-up, or you can super jump into a 3-way.

The knockdown from 2c 2a feels shorter in CC though, though that could be my imagination.

Sadly it's also character specific on where opponents go after 214A. they all have different wall bouncing hitboxes.

Well, that's new... Are there specific characters that are good for testing on? Or do I actually need to go through the whole cast?

I don't have a list yet, cause some of them also depend on how low you get the 5BB 214A and some switch after a certain frame on which side your 2C ends up on. It's really annoying...
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 08, 2012, 07:01:07 PM
Edit: Also wanted to mention that you can still do:

2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c tkj.236b 5bb 214a (walk towards corner) 2c 5c 22a 2c 623b 236a236a236a

Yeah, it still can be done but I think it's also character specific. Second 236A tends to whiff on some characters.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 09, 2012, 03:30:18 AM
And lastly, I'm hearing stories on 2ch that people are getting fed up with all the Full moon Ryoug players and are beginning to focus their attention on Half, lol.  Someone discovered a knife pickup throw loop too.  I won't believe it until I see it in a video though.  Might be too good to be true.  But if it is true...

I actually remember seeing some knife pick-up combo a while back. Don't remember where I saw it, and it might've been a previous patch (?) of CC as well.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 09, 2012, 10:16:36 AM
I actually remember seeing some knife pick-up combo a while back. Don't remember where I saw it, and it might've been a previous patch (?) of CC as well.

That was probably from Fuusui's combo I posted above, but this other knife throw combo is an actual loop.  The basic notation is:

For Akiha, V Akiha, Tohno, Powerd Ciel, Len, White Len, Roa, Satsuki only:

2A*4 > 5A 6A 2B 5BB 2C 5C 22A > 2C 3C 22A > [2A 2C 3C 22A]*n

For Warachia, Kouma, Riesbyfe, Aoko only:

2A*4 > 5A 6A 5BB 2B 2C 5C 22A > 2C delay 3C 22A > [2A 2C delay 5C 22A > 2A 2C delay 3C 22A]*2

Notation added verbatim.  I haven't tried these yet, as my execution isn't all that great but if someone else could test them and post their results, please do.  Man, where's Slowpoke when you need him?  :psyduck:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Greg January 09, 2012, 11:16:35 AM
Edit: Also wanted to mention that you can still do:

2a 2b 5bb 5c 2c tkj.236b 5bb 214a (walk towards corner) 2c 5c 22a 2c 623b 236a236a236a

Yeah, it still can be done but I think it's also character specific. Second 236A tends to whiff on some characters.

If that's whiffing you just need more delay before/during your rekkas
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 09, 2012, 11:25:57 AM
I actually remember seeing some knife pick-up combo a while back. Don't remember where I saw it, and it might've been a previous patch (?) of CC as well.

That was probably from Fuusui's combo I posted above, but this other knife throw combo is an actual loop.  The basic notation is:

For Akiha, V Akiha, Tohno, Powerd Ciel, Len, White Len, Roa, Satsuki only:

2A*4 > 5A 6A 2B 5BB 2C 5C 22A > 2C 3C 22A > [2A 2C 3C 22A]*n

For Warachia, Kouma, Riesbyfe, Aoko only:

2A*4 > 5A 6A 5BB 2B 2C 5C 22A > 2C delay 3C 22A > [2A 2C delay 5C 22A > 2A 2C delay 3C 22A]*2

Notation added verbatim.  I haven't tried these yet, as my execution isn't all that great but if someone else could test them and post their results, please do.  Man, where's Slowpoke when you need him?  :psyduck:

Hmm... I'll gonna try/grind them out tonight.

If that's whiffing you just need more delay before/during your rekkas

Oh, so it's universal? I still need to get the timing down then.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 09, 2012, 11:40:20 AM
I personally can't seem to get the 5A 22A to connect after TK 236B. Is it just hilarious tight, or character specific, or what? ; __ ;

Just 5A when you see the other character fall at around roughly head height, and mash 22A right after.  Everything else should fall in place.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 09, 2012, 12:28:06 PM
One hour of training mode later...

I was only able to get three loops on Akiha.  The timing gets incredibly difficult by the end of the second rep, and the damage was so so (about 4.1k without a jump in).  On the bright side, I found an alternate method without having to resort to 2AAA 5AA, which is awesome. 

You can do the tk j.236B > 5A 22A into the loop.  That makes it much more simplistic to execute in matches, imo.  You can probably stick in a 214A_214C > air combo in there somewhere most definitely.  Not sure how yet, need to test it more.  I stuck in the rekka enders instead to get a forced knockdown into oki for about 4451 damage on Akiha.

tl;dr

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C tk j.236B > 5A 22A > 2C 3C 22A > 2A 2C delay 5C 22A > 2C 3C...
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 09, 2012, 02:46:45 PM
Here is how it looks like: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAhH9-hbXXo

Didn't do reps, you could say it's the simplified version.

Might do one with reps... or not.  :prinny:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 09, 2012, 03:44:41 PM
One hour of training mode later...

I was only able to get three loops on Akiha.  The timing gets incredibly difficult by the end of the second rep, and the damage was so so (about 4.1k without a jump in).  On the bright side, I found an alternate method without having to resort to 2AAA 5AA, which is awesome. 

You can do the tk j.236B > 5A 22A into the loop.  That makes it much more simplistic to execute in matches, imo.  You can probably stick in a 214A_214C > air combo in there somewhere most definitely.  Not sure how yet, need to test it more.  I stuck in the rekka enders instead to get a forced knockdown into oki for about 4451 damage on Akiha.

tl;dr

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C tk j.236B > 5A 22A > 2C 3C 22A > 2A 2C delay 5C 22A > 2C 3C...

Tested it out (this is without a rekka ender, though, I think the damage added would be pretty negligible anyway.)

~3 reps on V. Sion did 5.1k (23 hits)
~4 reps on V. Sion did 5.3k (30 hits)

~3 reps on Akiha did around 4.7k (26 hits)
~4 reps on Akiha did 4.8k (30 hits)

And for comparison, a standard corner bnb on Akiha does 4.5k

Not sure if you can do more than 4 reps. Damage scaling rapes you after the 3rd rep or so. Also, if this is like MBAA, then having it be a 30 hit combo gives your opponent like a million meter, so it's probably not worth it to go over ~20 hits or so.

Edit: think I miscounted my rep numbers. Adjusted my numbers to reflect that. I'll probably retest this stuff when I'm less lazy.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 09, 2012, 07:25:34 PM
Also wanted to add that you can actually go into the loop off of her overhead. Might be the most damaging option.

It's just 4c -> [22a 2c 3c 22a 2a 2c 3c 5c]*n

2 reps on V. Sion is around 3.2k damage.
3 reps on V. Sion is around 3.5k damage.

Edit: fixed rep numbers, and combo notation
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 09, 2012, 08:14:12 PM
Hey, that's good to know.  And also, instead of 4c -> [22a 2c 3c 22a 2c 3c 5c]*n, did you mean 4c -> [22a 2c 3c 22a 2a 2c 3c 5c]*n?

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Rei January 09, 2012, 08:47:24 PM
Only problem I really have with H-Ryougi right now is damage nerf up the ass :/...
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: COD3player January 09, 2012, 09:52:28 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hp5ZzSrLEA
The 4th clip shows the loop in action. That same variant also works on Ries as well.

It's kinda silly how F-Ryougi got these damage buffs and H-Ryougi got damage nerfs and they fucked her 214A combos up so hard. I don't mind the removal of 3C loop but messing with 214A was going overboard imo. It's so annoying. But what can you do? I still find H infinitely more enjoyable to play than F but seeing F makes me go mreh and I wonder if investing all the time into this character will be worth it down the road. Fusui is the only H-Ryougi player I've seen so far and all we can use for reference it seems.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 09, 2012, 09:58:57 PM
Hey, that's good to know.  And also, instead of 4c -> [22a 2c 3c 22a 2c 3c 5c]*n, did you mean 4c -> [22a 2c 3c 22a 2a 2c 3c 5c]*n?

Yes.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 09, 2012, 10:12:15 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hp5ZzSrLEA
The 4th clip shows the loop in action. That same variant also works on Ries as well.

It's kinda silly how F-Ryougi got these damage buffs and H-Ryougi got damage nerfs and they fucked her 214A combos up so hard. I don't mind the removal of 3C loop but messing with 214A was going overboard imo. It's so annoying. But what can you do? I still find H infinitely more enjoyable to play than F but seeing F makes me go mreh and I wonder if investing all the time into this character will be worth it down the road. Fusui is the only H-Ryougi player I've seen so far and all we can use for reference it seems.

+Heat.

Those were some sexy combos.  And yeah, it does suck that 214A got nerfed (along with a whole bunch of other things non-combo related) but on the plus side at least we have new combos to play with.  Although most of that had to do with the new knife pickup properties.

F is...simple.  Well rounded, and basic.  I won't deny she's a bit more straight-forward to play compared to H, but you have to admit she really needed all that stuff.  Her PS2 version was really lacking.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 09, 2012, 10:17:57 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hp5ZzSrLEA
The 4th clip shows the loop in action. That same variant also works on Ries as well.

It's kinda silly how F-Ryougi got these damage buffs and H-Ryougi got damage nerfs and they fucked her 214A combos up so hard. I don't mind the removal of 3C loop but messing with 214A was going overboard imo. It's so annoying. But what can you do? I still find H infinitely more enjoyable to play than F but seeing F makes me go mreh and I wonder if investing all the time into this character will be worth it down the road. Fusui is the only H-Ryougi player I've seen so far and all we can use for reference it seems.

To be fair, her damage was really high last game. If your opponent guessed wrong like twice, and you didn't drop the soap, they were basically dead.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 09, 2012, 10:31:01 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hp5ZzSrLEA
The 4th clip shows the loop in action. That same variant also works on Ries as well.

It's kinda silly how F-Ryougi got these damage buffs and H-Ryougi got damage nerfs and they fucked her 214A combos up so hard. I don't mind the removal of 3C loop but messing with 214A was going overboard imo. It's so annoying. But what can you do? I still find H infinitely more enjoyable to play than F but seeing F makes me go mreh and I wonder if investing all the time into this character will be worth it down the road. Fusui is the only H-Ryougi player I've seen so far and all we can use for reference it seems.

To be fair, her damage was really high last game. If your opponent guessed wrong like twice, and you didn't drop the soap, they were basically dead.

Gotta agree with that, her damage was pretty high.

HF already posted a video but yeah, loops: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCXAnepwJ9U
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 09, 2012, 11:06:56 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hp5ZzSrLEA
The 4th clip shows the loop in action. That same variant also works on Ries as well.

It's kinda silly how F-Ryougi got these damage buffs and H-Ryougi got damage nerfs and they fucked her 214A combos up so hard. I don't mind the removal of 3C loop but messing with 214A was going overboard imo. It's so annoying. But what can you do? I still find H infinitely more enjoyable to play than F but seeing F makes me go mreh and I wonder if investing all the time into this character will be worth it down the road. Fusui is the only H-Ryougi player I've seen so far and all we can use for reference it seems.

To be fair, her damage was really high last game. If your opponent guessed wrong like twice, and you didn't drop the soap, they were basically dead.

Gotta agree with that, her damage was pretty high.

HF already posted a video but yeah, loops: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DCXAnepwJ9U

Oh, that's HF? Too many name changes on this forum.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: COD3player January 09, 2012, 11:20:21 PM
+Heat.

Those were some sexy combos.  And yeah, it does suck that 214A got nerfed (along with a whole bunch of other things non-combo related) but on the plus side at least we have new combos to play with.  Although most of that had to do with the new knife pickup properties.

F is...simple.  Well rounded, and basic.  I won't deny she's a bit more straight-forward to play compared to H, but you have to admit she really needed all that stuff.  Her PS2 version was really lacking.
All things considered, I can live without the 3C loop and the lower damage. But the 214A change is the one thing that steams my beans the most. Not being able to tick into arc drive kinda hurts too. New combos to use aren't a bad thing but it does feel like a hassle at times having to learn SO much character-specific material. F was the style I started with back in PS2 and yeah she was really lacking and the changes she got in 1.07 do help but seem really crazy at the same time given how the game has changed since then.

To be fair, her damage was really high last game. If your opponent guessed wrong like twice, and you didn't drop the soap, they were basically dead.
Yeah it's me. :psyduck:  I was wondering when you'd start posting in here.

Damage in general was pretty high in PS2. And by the same token, if she guessed wrong twice, the Red Cross would be right around the corner. Remember the times we played the H-Ries and H-Ryougi match? :V I'm starting to have flashbacks. Feels like a lifetime ago.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 09, 2012, 11:28:12 PM
Yeah... Those matches ended pretty quickly. She seems like a more rounded character now. Not sure if that's for better or worse now. I think she's still pretty viable okay now with her 4.5k combos off of hit confirms. Also, what's average combo damage in this game anyway?

Edited for truth.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 10, 2012, 12:48:55 AM
Average damage varies.  I'd say anywhere between 4.3k to 5.1k maybe?  Don't quote me on that.

Updated first post.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 10, 2012, 04:24:05 AM
Just looked over the changes, and I am now saddened.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Ichipoo January 10, 2012, 10:58:34 AM
Sorry for the late reply but thanks to those who responded to my question regarding the differences between H and C. I'm still deciding which Moon to play seriously though. :psyduck:

However, I'd like to learn more about F if possible but no thread containing information on it exists. :(
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Sashi January 10, 2012, 11:15:54 AM
FRyougi is like fishing. You sit back and get counter hits with your silly 5B. And then you land 5k combos for no effort. And then you do it again until you get a bucket of fish and you can start grilling them. But if a fish jumps out of the water and tries to eat you, you have drop your rod and hide behind a tree until the fish needs to go back in the water to breath.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Rei January 10, 2012, 12:21:44 PM
FRyougi is like fishing. You sit back and get counter hits with your silly 5B. And then you land 5k combos for no effort. And then you do it again until you get a bucket of fish and you can start grilling them. But if a fish jumps out of the water and tries to eat you, you have drop your rod and hide behind a tree until the fish needs to go back in the water to breath.

You forgot about j.B
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Sashi January 10, 2012, 12:29:53 PM
Manly man Fryougurt only 5Bs. j.B requires effort.

On a serious note, I don't know if they changed the hitbox or the timing or I'm simply even worse than before, but I get counter hit out of j.B a lot more than before.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Rei January 10, 2012, 01:58:26 PM
j.B and j.C's hitboxes are strictly worse
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Ichipoo January 10, 2012, 02:02:44 PM
FRyougi is like fishing. You sit back and get counter hits with your silly 5B. And then you land 5k combos for no effort. And then you do it again until you get a bucket of fish and you can start grilling them. But if a fish jumps out of the water and tries to eat you, you have drop your rod and hide behind a tree until the fish needs to go back in the water to breath.
(http://arch.413chan.net/mah_nigga-%28n1310692687557%29.png)

 :fap: :fap: :fap:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 10, 2012, 03:31:46 PM
FRyougi is like fishing. You sit back and get counter hits with your silly 5B. And then you land 5k combos for no effort. And then you do it again until you get a bucket of fish and you can start grilling them. But if a fish jumps out of the water and tries to eat you, you have drop your rod and hide behind a tree until the fish needs to go back in the water to breath. and j.B

Fyougi in a nutshell. :V

I guess there's no need for a Fyougi thread then?  :nyoro:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Ichipoo January 10, 2012, 05:46:56 PM
FRyougi is like fishing. You sit back and get counter hits with your silly 5B. And then you land 5k combos for no effort. And then you do it again until you get a bucket of fish and you can start grilling them. But if a fish jumps out of the water and tries to eat you, you have drop your rod and hide behind a tree until the fish needs to go back in the water to breath. and j.B

Fyougi in a nutshell. :V

I guess there's no need for a Fyougi thread then?  :nyoro:
Guess not? lol :psyduck:

Just have someone post mixups, combos, Oki situations in F-Ryougi's section and I think we're good. ;)
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Theta Sigma January 11, 2012, 08:47:21 AM
Uh, sorry for my confuse post , i have already fix the problem with the loop.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 11, 2012, 11:36:39 AM
If you could re-edit your entire sentence for clarification, I might be able to help you out.  I don't have a clue as to what you're having problems with.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 11, 2012, 10:03:48 PM
Someone mentioned earlier about having problems with Ryougi's air game -- namely, being counterhit often.  I've had that problem quite a lot too.  Her hitboxes are pretty tame now, so trying to properly space in the air against characters with 5 frame j.A moves is much harder now than before.  I used to try to fish for counterhits in the air by spacing with j.6B back in AA, but that strategy doesn't work all that great in 1.07.

The solution?

Not sure if there is one, sadly.  Fortunately, j.236B is still an amazing aerial special with a generous hitbox and a 9 nine frame startup.  I'm starting to use that more to train people to be more hesitant when going air-to-air against Ryougi.  The problem with that though is that if blocked, you run the risk of being punished.

j.22B might be worth more value now, considering it jumps back a bit.  Throwing the knife away for a potential air counterhit...but I'm not sure if that's a good idea for a measly combo.

The other strategy is to simply out space people.  If you watch Fuusui, he does this a lot.  Don't press buttons when they're close by and definitely don't try to counter attack when you're in a bad position -- just run away to safety.  I don't know why French Bread gave her the worst set of air-to-ground normals out of the entire cast.  Every other character in the game has at least one move that hits below them. 

Just my two cents.

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Rokunaya January 11, 2012, 11:24:51 PM
The other strategy is to simply out space people.  If you watch Fuusui, he does this a lot. Don't press buttons when they're close by and definitely don't try to counter attack when you're in a bad position -- just run away to safety.  I don't know why French Bread gave her the worst set of air-to-ground normals out of the entire cast.  Every other character in the game has at least one move that hits below them. 

Just my two cents.

So... Hryougi has to play like every other character in the game now?

Awesome.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Theta Sigma January 12, 2012, 05:29:28 AM
Are There more videos os Fusui in 1.07? i only saw that was posted on the 1st page.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: MasaBlade January 12, 2012, 01:14:55 PM
what do you guys think is her best oki after an airthrow?
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LuminAbyss January 12, 2012, 04:43:16 PM
I usually do A rekka, since it's fast and covers a lot of space. I kinda stole it from watching Japanese players pfft.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LivingShadow January 13, 2012, 03:49:09 AM
I've been doing that long before the Jap players have been. Sometimes I throw out 623b, because I can and people forget it's a low.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 18, 2012, 09:38:51 PM
I just tested a couple of combos on all the cast and made a spreadsheet. Figured if we find more stuff we can add to it or w/e.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuPPjA98AQ5gdE5FWi1GRERLT2hZWXpwWkNCRndUNmc&hl=en_US#gid=0

First is the knife pickup loop. I used : 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C tkj.236B 5A [22A 2C 3C 22A 2A 2C delay 5C]x2 2C 3C 623B 236Ax3.

Second, I used 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C TKj.236B 5BB 214A 2C 5C 22A 2C 3C 623B 236Ax3 to test the direction of 2C after landing from 214A. (you have to be facing away from the corner when connecting with 2C for this combo to work)((Yes= combo works))

*= Timing is strict, can be done but you'd have to delay alot.
Both combos were done by Akiha and I used the dummy to test it on everyone.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbb9WQdvqbo

Also, I just found out another way to initiate knife pickup loop but it uses meter =/. Interesting nonetheless, what do you guys think?

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Charby January 19, 2012, 09:06:00 AM
Why dont you use the wiki instead of Google Docs
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 19, 2012, 10:49:28 AM
Nice combo.  Kinda weird how the rekkas hardly add any extra damage at the end, but I guess every hit counts.

As far as air-to-air goes these days, I've been experimenting with j.A a lot more since it hasn't been changed from the PS2 version.  The hitbox is still very large (much larger than most other character's j.A hitboxes), and covers more horizontal / vertical range than j.B (plus it's 1 frame faster to boot).  The trade off is that her hitbox is included within it, so getting counter hit in the air is just as dangerous.

So in a nutshell you have to play chicken for your air neutral game and go aggressive for your ground neutral game.  What a strange character.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 19, 2012, 01:41:02 PM
Why dont you use the wiki instead of Google Docs
I guess I could do that, but is it really neccassory for like character specific stuff?

Nice combo.  Kinda weird how the rekkas hardly add any extra damage at the end, but I guess every hit counts.

As far as air-to-air goes these days, I've been experimenting with j.A a lot more since it hasn't been changed from the PS2 version.  The hitbox is still very large (much larger than most other character's j.A hitboxes), and covers more horizontal / vertical range than j.B (plus it's 1 frame faster to boot).  The trade off is that her hitbox is included within it, so getting counter hit in the air is just as dangerous.

So in a nutshell you have to play chicken for your air neutral game and go aggressive for your ground neutral game.  What a strange character.

Damage scaling kicks in hard, it may be optimal to go for one loop instead of two. (rekkas might actually do more dmg  :mystery:)

I usually stay on the ground and try to AA with 5A and as for air-to-air situations I'm starting to use j.6B more now.

I just noticed I had the docs were set on private, my bad lolol. They're open now, so if anyone wants to edit go ahead.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 22, 2012, 12:31:18 AM
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm16680831
yt ver: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTDEpduzces
H-Ryougi tutorial. Quality is kinda meh but it's watchable, some interesting stuff

Knife pickup loop after 5BB 214A actually works. you'd have to walk back and bit and then do 5A 22A into the loop. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5NEAMuxu00
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: COD3player January 22, 2012, 01:41:30 AM
Just wanted to add, that for the combo at 2:41, after 623B, you can do 6AAA 22X j.ABC dj.BC air throw for a little extra damage and even more meter gain, like 20% more.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 22, 2012, 09:21:16 AM
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm16680831

H-Ryougi tutorial. Quality is kinda meh but it's watchable, some interesting stuff

Knife pickup loop after 5BB 214A actually works. you'd have to walk back and bit and then do 5A 22A into the loop. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5NEAMuxu00

Augh, you beat me to it.  It was pretty meh during the first few minutes, and the only interesting thing I noted was the addition of 63214A into a combo.  I'd rather learn about option selects and gimmicks for her though.  Stuff like run up 2A 412C 2C (if that even works lol)
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: MasaBlade January 22, 2012, 02:12:09 PM
using 63214A is pretty interesting, i'll probably use it on netplay for consistency.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Nandeyanen January 23, 2012, 01:53:53 AM
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm16680831

H-Ryougi tutorial. Quality is kinda meh but it's watchable, some interesting stuff

Knife pickup loop after 5BB 214A actually works. you'd have to walk back and bit and then do 5A 22A into the loop. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5NEAMuxu00

Augh, you beat me to it.  It was pretty meh during the first few minutes, and the only interesting thing I noted was the addition of 63214A into a combo.  I'd rather learn about option selects and gimmicks for her though.  Stuff like run up 2A 412C 2C (if that even works lol)

Can always 4c 421c 4c.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: COD3player January 23, 2012, 11:16:40 PM
I can't get the knife pickup loop as consistently as I would like. There are seemingly random times when I'm too far in front of the knife and pressing 22X won't pick it up. :psyduck: Then there are other times where I'll get the knife pickup, but then my 2A 2C doesn't come out and I just get knife throw instead. I guess I'm hitting my 2A too early.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LuminAbyss January 24, 2012, 05:46:43 AM
My problem seems to be linking the 2A after picking up the knife, I can't seem to catch them before they're already on the ground.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 24, 2012, 11:34:06 AM
I can't get the knife pickup loop as consistently as I would like. There are seemingly random times when I'm too far in front of the knife and pressing 22X won't pick it up. :psyduck: Then there are other times where I'll get the knife pickup, but then my 2A 2C doesn't come out and I just get knife throw instead. I guess I'm hitting my 2A too early.

I had problems at first but the key is to delay the 5A 22A as late as possible. I think 2C 3C timing is also a factor, when done right after 22X they usually "float" for a short time so 2A should be hit after the animation is almost done.

Some characters seem to "float" a bit alot. For example with Satsuki, I can link 5A 22A 2C 3C 22X (5A 22A or even 5BB into 63214A) you'd have to cancel 22X into 5A or 5BB immediately though.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Senel January 25, 2012, 05:46:50 AM


Knife pickup loop after 5BB 214A actually works. you'd have to walk back and bit and then do 5A 22A into the loop. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5NEAMuxu00

Ooh, nice. I have to give this a try--good job!
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Charby January 25, 2012, 08:13:22 AM
My problem seems to be linking the 2A after picking up the knife, I can't seem to catch them before they're already on the ground.
Same here anyone got a trick for that?
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame January 25, 2012, 08:49:02 AM
There's no trick, just practice.  Get a feel for the timing.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika January 25, 2012, 12:15:47 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C56_cdWf4Eo

Ok, I was able to get one rep of the pseudo sweep loop down (if that even counts as any) and you can do it midscreen. After a 2A rebeat (and whiff) you switch sides and 2A 2C connects so think of knife pickup loop but without the knife lol. I can only do one rep though, second rep is possible but it's just ridiculously tight.  :psyduck:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: MasaBlade January 27, 2012, 11:31:30 AM
if you do the 5bb 214a into knife loop in the corner, it's actually counter-productive to do the loop more than once. if you go straight into the ender after one it does 5.23k.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egPYE2_q9ng (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egPYE2_q9ng) a little blockstring i made now that its a little harder to get through the guard meter
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Justice January 30, 2012, 08:25:38 PM
My problem seems to be linking the 2A after picking up the knife, I can't seem to catch them before they're already on the ground.

I usually get that when I cancel 3C too late.  I find the easiest way to do is just to do 2C 3C2[2] (3C hits) A, delay, A without letting go of 2.  That prevents you from throwing the knife again too.

I actually think the hardest part is getting it so 2C hits after 2A.  Doing 2C 3C 623B once before starting the loop helps since it increases gravity but that also makes it kind of hard to link the 2C after.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika February 01, 2012, 02:08:06 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKZx8MlCtAM

My very first H-Ryougi combo video.  :nyoro:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame February 01, 2012, 07:59:49 PM
That was awesome, and those setups look pretty legit.  Good stuff all around!
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame February 01, 2012, 08:35:26 PM
Haven't posted here in a while, so I'll add some new stuff to the thread.

Apparently you can combo 623B after any ground combo > 5A 22A.  Not as easy command-wise though.  The timing is very strict.

You can also do stuff like:

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 5A 22A > 623B > 2C 3C 421C > knife loop

...at least according to 2ch.  Also, 2ch is saying Crescent is starting to look stronger than Full.  Something to do with Ieda, I think.  Or maybe the fact that Leo isn't playing F as much anymore lol

For okizeme, I'm starting to like that 63214A after any 2C ender. You get a nice mixup from an air knife catch into high / low games.  Damage output is less though...
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika February 02, 2012, 12:01:10 AM
Haven't posted here in a while, so I'll add some new stuff to the thread.

Apparently you can combo 623B after any ground combo > 5A 22A.  Not as easy command-wise though.  The timing is very strict.

You can also do stuff like:

2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 5A 22A > 623B > 2C 3C 421C > knife loop

...at least according to 2ch.  Also, 2ch is saying Crescent is starting to look stronger than Full.  Something to do with Ieda, I think.  Or maybe the fact that Leo isn't playing F as much anymore lol

For okizeme, I'm starting to like 63214A after any 2C ender. You get a nice mixup from an air knife catch into high / low games.  Damage output is less though...

Sweet, of all the moves I tried to do after 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 5A 22A I haven't tested out 623B lol. I'll test that out sometime.

63214A oki is pretty good but yeah damage output being less is the downside. It might be viable to do after rekkas but I haven't tested it out enough.

After a ground combo > 5A (delay) 236B 236B(whiff) 214A 2A 2C > w/e actually works on a few characters. The delay after 5A is character specific. 236A also works.

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Red Leather Jacket February 02, 2012, 05:03:20 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKZx8MlCtAM

My very first H-Ryougi combo video.  :nyoro:

This video is fantastic :D

Great job, weika!
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: MasaBlade February 02, 2012, 12:45:55 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKZx8MlCtAM

My very first H-Ryougi combo video.  :nyoro:

good shit man, glad to see someone likes the blockstring i posted lol
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Greg February 02, 2012, 01:02:31 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKZx8MlCtAM

My very first H-Ryougi combo video.  :nyoro:

good shit man, glad to see someone likes the blockstring i posted lol

You do realize that 63214a is minus on block, right? They just need to hit buttons after it and they get out cause if you do anything besides block you're eating a counter hit. There's no reason not to just do 22a unless you're a showboating douchebag.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Sashi February 02, 2012, 01:03:37 PM
There's no reason not to just do 22a unless you're a showboating douchebag.
Isn't that the entire reason to play H-Ryougi?
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika February 02, 2012, 11:56:18 PM
Yup, 63214A on block isn't exactly safe but I just did it anyways since it's flashy lol :fap: But yeah, I'd recommend sticking with 22a instead.

I tested out the ground combo > 5A 22A > 623B, it connects but I can't combo into knife loop, the knife ends up pretty far away for you to be able to pick up. Unless it's done on a certain range I don't think it's possible, I might be wrong.

After 2C delayed 22A oki works (same oki as 63214A: left, right, high, low) I was able to do a crossup j.6B with it by accident too. It's probably specific though (due to hitbox of certain characters and whatnot)

With all this new info I'll probably update the wiki.... someday.  :mystery:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Rokunaya February 03, 2012, 04:56:29 AM
Weika the setups for the knifetoss/pickup in your vid are all done just for flash and pizzaz right? Because they all look hilariously mashable.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika February 03, 2012, 09:18:23 AM
Weika the setups for the knifetoss/pickup in your vid are all done just for flash and pizzaz right? Because they all look hilariously mashable.

Of course, I think that's pretty obvious.  :nyoro: You can bait alot of stuff with them though.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Numakie February 03, 2012, 09:48:22 AM
http://shoryuken.com/2012/02/03/mbaacc-butterfly-a-h-ryougi-combo-video/

Look what i found on SRK.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Justice February 03, 2012, 06:16:37 PM
Ugh why is it so hard to do 2A 2C on half the cast?  Even when I delay the 2A to hit as low as possible the 2C still whiffs 95% of the time.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame February 03, 2012, 10:45:14 PM
Well here's your answer: 2B.  And a few other different variations on other characters.  And look at all that meter she's building...

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm16866242
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Justice February 03, 2012, 11:56:40 PM
Well here's your answer: 2B.  And a few other different variations on other characters.  And look at all that meter she's building...

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm16866242

Yeah, you're right, that's a hundred times easier.  Someone should put it on the wiki.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika February 04, 2012, 01:15:17 AM
Well here's your answer: 2B.  And a few other different variations on other characters.  And look at all that meter she's building...

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm16866242

Ohhh, back to the lab.  :toot:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: MasaBlade February 04, 2012, 07:19:38 PM
There's no reason not to just do 22a unless you're a showboating douchebag.
Isn't that the entire reason to play H-Ryougi?
^this.

in all seriousness, i've never had anyone push buttons on me when i use 63214. it's not something that you'll use all the time obviously, but it's useful regardless.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika February 04, 2012, 11:06:16 PM
I was about to update the wiki but I see most of the stuff are posted up already. Good shit to whoever updated it.

Updated the spreadsheet as well.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Charby February 05, 2012, 12:21:12 PM
I found something rly interesting for midscreen, instead of going 5c 2c 236a 236a 214a
You go 2c 5c 236a 236a 214a, and it puts you closer than the over version so you can rly tk 236b -crossup afterward) or even go for 8 6.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: miller483 February 07, 2012, 03:16:25 AM
if you do the 5bb 214a into knife loop in the corner, it's actually counter-productive to do the loop more than once. if you go straight into the ender after one it does 5.23k.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egPYE2_q9ng (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egPYE2_q9ng) a little blockstring i made now that its a little harder to get through the guard meter

If it isn't too much trouble could I get the full notation for the guard crush string?
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Justice February 07, 2012, 06:55:51 PM
if you do the 5bb 214a into knife loop in the corner, it's actually counter-productive to do the loop more than once. if you go straight into the ender after one it does 5.23k.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egPYE2_q9ng (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egPYE2_q9ng) a little blockstring i made now that its a little harder to get through the guard meter

If it isn't too much trouble could I get the full notation for the guard crush string?

I can't remember exactly what he's doing in that video but the version I do is:

2A 5B 2B 5C 2C 22A > 5B 2B 5C 2C 3C 22X > [5B 2B 5C 63214A > 2A 5B 2B 5C 2C 3C 22X >]

> is where the frametraps are.  You should be able to beat a jab but you'll lose to a DP or a shield so don't get too autopilot with it.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Justice February 10, 2012, 07:33:10 PM
Lol 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C 22X (knife pickup) 2C 22C > knife loop works.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Red Leather Jacket March 05, 2012, 09:15:38 PM
So I've mainly been playing C-Ryougi throughout my short Melty Blood career, however I have been urged by some folks...or just Greg I guess...to give H-Ryougi a shot.

What are her essentials?
Main combos?
Main block strings?
General tricky bullshit?

Danke schon! :)
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Rei March 06, 2012, 07:11:05 AM
I just saw a 10 minute video yesterday on nico about H-Ryougi knife loops...

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm17078441
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame March 06, 2012, 09:13:52 PM
So I've mainly been playing C-Ryougi throughout my short Melty Blood career, however I have been urged by some folks...or just Greg I guess...to give H-Ryougi a shot.

What are her essentials?
Main combos?
Main block strings?
General tricky bullshit?

Danke schon! :)

Essentials:
Master these three things and you'll be on your way to eternal greatness
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Red Leather Jacket March 06, 2012, 09:19:29 PM
I guess I'll just have to keep the questions I have about the character for when I see Greg IRL.  -__- 

Ya'll are so very helpful.  :psyduck:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame March 06, 2012, 10:03:28 PM
I know it looks like troll advice, but it's really the truth.  The first part seems standard par, but Ryougi is a special case in which her frametraps and blockstrings vary a bit differently because of her slow normals.  Using the knife effectively here is real important as one slip up and you'll lose the advantage real quickly.

The second part is true because you want to maximize the hurt.  Surf the thread a bit and read up on her wiki -- you'll find all the combos you need. There are a ton of videos on youtube out there too, like Weika's combo vid.  You shouldn't have a problem with this part.

And the last part is extra true, because guess what?  Ryougi is the stamina equivalent of a toothpick, so guess wrong twice and you lose. 
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Crusayer March 06, 2012, 10:16:31 PM
I'm having a lot of trouble doing the 2C after the 2A after the knife pick up too.  Is it because they're too high up or something?  I can't seem to land the 2B or 5B variant on hime at all.

(This is after 2A 2B 5BB 5C 2C tkj236B 5A 22A 2C 5C 22A).
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame March 06, 2012, 10:42:58 PM
It's mostly a character-by-character weight issue.  Some characters need more hits in order for them to increase with 'gravity' and land into 2C.  That's often fixed by inserting more hits into the combo.  You can see this clearly by watching this video from Nico (that coincidentally, Rei linked to lol)

http://youtu.be/lemvQlvX53o

You can see Hime at the 8:33 time stamp (link for the lazy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lemvQlvX53o&t=8m32s)

The most notable section of the video is where Ryougi performs the loop on herself.  2A 2C doesn't really work here because of Ryougi's wonky hitbox when she falls (her feet are missing).  That makes 5B > 22A a much more significantly important loop to perform over the 2A, 2C counterpart. 
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame April 29, 2012, 11:12:58 AM
Two videos featuring Japanese players.  The first is a small match featuring Namiyan, one of the best Full moon style players in Japan.  He plays Half for just one match, and shows off some interesting stuff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-4rxueHCtgt#t=7m26s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-4rxueHCtgt#t=7m26s)

The second video, I have no idea who's playing.  But it's netplay, and I'm assuming the player is Japanese.  14 minutes of Half moon play, so all around it's interesting to see another person's playstyle.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3r_s-XnOww (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3r_s-XnOww)

Enjoy.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika May 08, 2012, 11:37:16 AM
Thanks for sharing CPhame. Namiyan's H-Ryougi was really interesting, 3C jump back knife air pick-up is something I discovered recently. It's good to see it being applied. Also, his strings are more C-moon based which is something I don't see/do as often.

I did not know that 5A6AA 214B 5A6A worked loll  :toot:
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: LivingShadow May 08, 2012, 11:55:57 AM
I did not know that 5A6AA 214B 5A6A worked loll  :toot:
First time I've seen that happen too.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Sashi July 06, 2012, 09:36:01 PM
Anyone know why 5A(whiff) 4/6(A+D) is 5A Shield instead of 5A Throw? Every other character in the game gets 5A Throw. It's like how Satsuki in MBAC has a different j.4/6(A+B+D) than every other character (air(back)dash instead of shield).

Maybe since she has the only level 2 5A in Half Moon?
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame July 13, 2012, 12:35:47 AM
@Sacchin 22A: Sorry, I don't really have a clue why. 

Stumbled upon another good video on Nico.  The player's name is Nanguu (or Minamimiya, depending on how you read it) and is a 5th dan Shiki player.  This guy's Ryougi playstyle is pretty impressive -- especially in his first match at the 6:20 mark, where he pulls off this really sick corner combo. 

Check it out here http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm18226064 (http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm18226064).

Also, if you check out the Japanese wiki you'll find that there are now animated gifs of various Half Moon combos, some of which might surprise you.

You can find those here http://www20.atwiki.jp/ryougisiki/ (http://www20.atwiki.jp/ryougisiki/).
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika July 13, 2012, 07:44:21 AM
Sickk, thanks as always CPhame. Gonna grind these new combos and see if I can come up with better variations as well.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Sashi July 13, 2012, 10:46:16 AM
TKj.236B combooooooos~! I still do FRyougi style rekka B combos on HRyougi. Does more than tk236B 214A combo.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: CPhame August 17, 2012, 10:55:19 PM
I'm probably posting this in the wrong place but, there's a really good concept match between Eve (Nero) and Namiyan (Ryougi).  Namiyan mostly plays Full, but he pops in with Half in the first part of the match. 

Part 1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FhjSfRjLjA

Part 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfqVNjK1RUo


Enjoy.

: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: papagaio May 15, 2013, 05:42:46 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=wZ_OclWbGDs

Bigorados, from Rio, made a pressure tutorial for H-Ryougi

he still doesn't have MBread account, so, I posted for him
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: AARP|ZTB May 15, 2013, 06:08:19 PM
damn, people still dont know about the 22C blowup...

Bunkering the first hit of 22C (pre-buffer 214 during ex flash, hold 4 mash D after flash) makes those strings in particular significantly weaker. It's pretty free for C/F moons as well and the only time you're guaranteed the pressure is if the opponent has less than 50%.

:(

I'm kind of tempted now to try and devise some counter-strats to 63214A strings lol.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Inso May 15, 2013, 07:17:47 PM
Funny, the bunker thing for me is actually distance dependant, works as long as I'm not in her face and I buffer the bunker almost at the same time she releases the knife. I find it a little awkward to pull off sometimes =T

And you don't really need to devise counter-strats cuz there is a gap, small but it's there. You can mash shield and/or DP when you realize she left the grond.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: weika May 26, 2013, 06:26:42 PM
yeah, 63214A is not particularly safe, even with knife pickup it's... meh.
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Kyhz July 03, 2013, 12:51:30 AM
I've seen Namiyan use [5B 22A 2C 3C 22X] x N, but I haven't tested it myself to see if it was easier or not. On paper though, it sounds like it should be. I tend to go for 623B loops in the corner since they're much easier. Knife pickup can definitely be cancelled early, but I'd be hard pressed to give you exact frames.
Here's the loop with 5B:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pqi-XTNdYrk&feature=youtu.be&t=19s
: Re: 1.07 H-Ryougi
: Kyhz July 03, 2013, 01:40:12 PM
623B loop is basically a poor man's knife loop. It's easier (or at least, I find it easier) and lets you end with rekkas for the knockdown without sacrificing damage compared to a regular air combo. As far as I know, 3 reps of [2C 3C 623B] is universal minus nekos, although the timing may vary slightly per character. Damage and meter gain isn't all that great either (gatlings into 623B loop into A rekkas  gives me about 86% and 4.3k on VSion), especially compared to knife loops (even just 2 knife reps gives over 100% and an extra 500dmg). The one good point about 623B loops is that it can be done midscreen, but it's very finicky and spacing dependent.