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Author Topic: [MBAACC] F-Ciel Thread (Get that "furry" garbage outta here!)  (Read 44860 times)

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Offline AARP|ZTB

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[MBAACC] F-Ciel Thread (Get that "furry" garbage outta here!)
« on: August 02, 2010, 02:33:07 PM »
F-Ciel Current Code Changes:
(Trl Notes by Curbeh)

F-Ciel:
2C - Recovery down
236AB - Stronger hitbox
214C - Recovery shorter
214A - Start up and speed faster
63214ABC - Stronger
AD -Easier to connect the last hit
623C - Prorate and vector weaker
4C - Hitbox, untech time weaker
J2C - Recovery increased
5C - Damage down
Air Somer - Movement after REMOVED
Air B Somer - Damage down

Additional Notes:
5[C] - Air Untechable time increased
63214B - Lower Wall Bounce
236B - hits more characters crouching, extended hitbox below arm
J214C - Black wave now has three block ticks instead of two.

Web Sites:

Current Code Changes (MeltyBread)
Regular updates and translations provided by Curbeh and other community members.

Ciel Thread
Japanese Ciel BBS. Provides Player discussion, speculations, combos, news & info, as well as CC specific changes.

Ciel Wiki
Japanese Wiki page. Provides a variety of information for Crescent, Half and Full Moon styles.

Match Videos: Last Update: 10/12/10
(Please provide link & time stamp if available)

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11609617 [~3:00-9:00]

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11645106 [~00-3:20 & 9:45-15:00]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewhFolFWwV8

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11959192 [~13:00]

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11957757 [~6:00 - 7:40]

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11958636 [~12:00]

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm12215671 [~8:50]

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm12386434 [~6:45]

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm12386787 [start - 2:00]
 
Combo Movies:
(Please provide link & time stamp if available)





Please feel free to link any material you may come across related to Full Moon Ciel. Any new information on CC changes, speculations, fighting theories, combos, websites and/or discussion would be appreciated.

 :teach:
« Last Edit: April 18, 2013, 07:18:04 PM by ZARbomb »
zar are you even aware that your attitude is what drove people off in the first place. i think zar's attitude is worse than all of that. cause neither of you guys mean anything. but zar can poison shit around him. zar's the one that gets personal online and does realtalk that's out of line.

Offline AARP|ZTB

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Re: MBAACC : Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread **Dis beech iz creyzee now!!*
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2010, 02:48:01 PM »
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11609617

3m-9m in.

Didn't want to blow up the first post with me nutting all over the thread...so I'll do it here!  :fap: :fap: :fap:

Holy shit, F-Ciel looks kinda bananas now. Like looked solid before but now she seems downright scary. Here are a few things I picked up on from the match vid linked above:

3:00
...It's F-Ciel....AAGGGHHH GET HYPE!!!

~3:19
Post SC combo: SC>2b>5[c]>wait>wait>waaaaait>236A?! Wow, ridiculous untech time now. The player even tried to tack on additional rape after but dropped eventually. Still...wtf. I see lots of combo potential with this new buff.

~3:37
Is it me or does 214A come out like a missile now? Could be the crap quality playing tricks on me though.  :mystery:

~4:51
Yeaaaah, that's what im talking about! He lands random 5[C] the proceeds to combo 2B>5[C] from the initial hit. This is non-CH 5[C] btw. 100% certain this is not doable in ps2 on non-CH. Too good.

~7:17
Lands bnb...does only 3.9k. Not good. Power down seems significant and I'm guessing F-ciel will be averaging under or between 4k-4.5k

~7:59
Man, just 22B here (to anyone who comes into this situation). 22C is still in ground state and satsuki AAD will just scoop that shit up. "Baka" indeed.

~8:19
Lands air-to-air CH. I'm thinking he could have just 2B>5[C]'d here and gone nuts. Gotta make use of those buffs!

~8:28
I messed my pants here. New Bcoma/cmd (command throw) has MUCH LOWER wallbounce now. My brain was going 100mps when I saw this. Oh man, the combo possibilities and potential setups... :psyduck:


Overall thoughts on the player:
Seemed like a decent F-ciel user. His neutral game at midscreen relied too heavily on dj2C (vs satsuki). It's good but I think will get him in trouble against certain types of players/characters. There were a few times he slipped under the satsuki player with dash but chose to do 5a instead of 5c>236a to strike from behind (I've had good results w/ this in the past). I think at some points he could have held ground with 2b>236a and force satsuki to the air (this is assuming that 5[C] CLASH IS STILL PRESENT!! [oh god, I hope so]). Can't wait to see more.

« Last Edit: August 03, 2010, 01:26:38 AM by ZARtacus! »
zar are you even aware that your attitude is what drove people off in the first place. i think zar's attitude is worse than all of that. cause neither of you guys mean anything. but zar can poison shit around him. zar's the one that gets personal online and does realtalk that's out of line.

Offline Tone

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damage nerfs make me sigh but by the looks of it, there's a lot more potential setups and tricks to use now... good stuff!
da  only mb player in north bay, get hype!

Offline Tempered

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Re: [MBAAC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread **Dis beech iz crehzee now!!**
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2010, 05:25:45 PM »
Zar I think you'll like this vid

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11645106
During Loser's Finals at NECX:

<Crowd at Jiyuna about to Lose> Na na na naaaa, na na na naaaa, hey hey hey, Goodbyeeee~

Offline Shiki

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Re: [MBAAC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread **Dis beech iz crehzee now!!**
« Reply #4 on: August 05, 2010, 05:34:53 PM »
Zar I think you'll like this vid

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11645106

Is that the video with the Day 1 F-Ciel? Lol.

Also, it seems like you can actually do a full combo off B command throw.

 :fap:

Offline Chie Satonaka

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Maybe it's just my eyes playing tricks on me, but is it me or did they make her falling speed from her airthrow slower?
« Last Edit: August 06, 2010, 07:50:37 AM by Ciel Is The Love Of My Life »
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Offline AARP|ZTB

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Zar I think you'll like this vid
Unfortunately, that wasn't the case, Tempered lol. I really appreciate the link though and it's good to see this random explosion of F-ciel users (even though they're exploding in the process lol).

Comments about 8/5 nico vid:

~00-1:30
Wow, pretty free. I've actually watched this match a bunch of times now already and at first he appears to "day one" like Shiki mentioned but his movement did seem solid (whenever he did get a chance to move lol). I think maybe he was just inexperienced with the matchup(?). There just wasn't enough being done for me to really comment further on this. He just got outplayed, I guess.

~1:38-3:20
This guy spent way too much time in the corner. Seemed he was trying to establish a defensive game but backing into the corner probably isnt the best way to go about it. Also, he air recovered back into the corner far too much (even took some risky shields on descent) rather than using other escape options e.g. forward air tech, tech>sdj>j236A - something =/. Just stop falling back into the corner (always).

~2:47
BE4B>236A. I dunno about this setup really. I think if you're going to commit to overhead you may as well go for 214A followup into damage (214A has enough pushback to make it safe on guard). Most ppl will just block low immediately after guarding the overhead (once they have seen the setup a number of times). Mixing between 4{B}>236A and 4[ B ]>214A is a bit stronger imo. Especially with the semi-charge prepping defenders to stand early to then eat the low flicker.

~3:00-3:09
Ok...you got blown up for backstepping by 2c>3[c] the first time. Ate "big" dmg for it. Why try for it again against the same exact string? Overall, I say this player made some really poor defensive choices and he was getting blown up a lot on wakeup for trying to move. However, his spacing and movement was a lot more "confident" than his partner's. Hope to see more these players in the future regardless.

~9:45
This player obviously has some long time experience. His movement is superb, spacing is solid, he transitions from defensive zoning/spacing to lockdown very well, and utilizes just about all of F-ciel's tools. There were a few things with his play that I couldn't agree with though:

~12:11
Looks like he was trying to bait out wakeup activation attempt. (sigh) sjC~[D]>5B anti-activate OS would have pretty much eliminated any chance of this occurring and he could have continued to pressure had there been no activation (which there wasn't). (I think there's a chance that many JP players don't know about this in general).

~12:24
Bcoma da gawd. Damage wasn't too great but then again what throw into combo followup deals outstanding dmg? The biggest plus imo was the corner positioning from a midscreen throw. :fap:

~13:50
Man, if I knew jp I would post on the bbs's about kouma/ries specific oki to help these guys out. He could have set up safejump here by simply dashing into immediate jump. Oh well. =/

~14:37
I really dont see the point in otg'ing after low flicker down. Dash>JC shenanigans are way more solid and eliminates unnecessary guess work. There are even OS's from the jC to punish all sorts of dumb shit on wakeup. Aside from his poor oki choices though, this dude is really good. May have to start compiling a list of JP F-Ciel users soon. The revolution is at hand.


Is that the video with the Day 1 F-Ciel? Lol.

Lol Diiiisssssssssss.

Maybe it's just my eyes playing tricks on me, but is it me or did they make her falling speed from her airthrow slower?
Garu was actually talking about this at Evo. Not falling speed specifically, but he was saying that the meaty after airthrow into corner (in CC) was nowhere as free as it is in console ver. Perhaps a change could have been put in place as the developers now seem to hate meaties and bs mixups post air throwing lol.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2010, 08:33:11 AM by ZARtacus! »
zar are you even aware that your attitude is what drove people off in the first place. i think zar's attitude is worse than all of that. cause neither of you guys mean anything. but zar can poison shit around him. zar's the one that gets personal online and does realtalk that's out of line.

Offline Chie Satonaka

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Maybe it's just my eyes playing tricks on me, but is it me or did they make her falling speed from her airthrow slower?
Garu was actually talking about this at Evo. Not falling speed specifically, but he was saying that the meaty after airthrow into corner (in CC) was nowhere as free as it is in console ver. Perhaps a change could have been put in place as the developers now seem to hate meaties and bs mixups post air throwing lol.

I dunno about that. Look at these specific time stamps:

~2:56~

She goes for a meaty flicker and Satsuki blocks it. Go back in PS2 and try that shit after an airthrow and regardless of the distance it'll whiff because she hasn't fully "woken up" yet. Maybe they changed the wake-up speeds for some characters or something?

~13:58~

She get's another BNB from 3[C] and goes for dash up 5A...and Kouma blocks it? Again go back in PS2 and test it...it'll whiff entirely. Now we know Kouma has one of the slowest, if not, slowest wake-up speeds in the game so in PS2 this should be standard.

Now assuming that wake-up speed hasn't changed at all, Satsuki shouldn't have been able to block the A Flicker and Kouma shouldn't have been able to block the 5A because both moves would've whiffed against the respective characters. Now if the wake-up speeds are different now than it's whatever, but maybe her post airthrow oki isn't as free as Garu mentioned because her falling speed on after airthrow is slower...who knows?

Edit: I know this isn't the C-Ciel board, but whatever. This could be something that's universal. H-F showed me a match video where she (C-Ciel) does a BNB and she tries to dash up 2A for oki....he jumps out. We both tested this in PS2 by having Ciel do the same BNB and trying to dash up 2A for oki while we try to jump out. We both got tagged. That only further convinces me that they actually slowed down her falling speed on air-throw...which is actually a pretty significant nerf no matter what style you play Ciel in. :S


AAAAAAAAAAAAND nevermind. Odds are it's this.

~Raw airthrows generate a special effect and have less recovery~

Regardless...this still hurts Ciel pretty bad.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2010, 03:12:56 PM by Ciel Is The Love Of My Life »
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Offline AARP|ZTB

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewhFolFWwV8

(Korean) CL is back and not sucking this time. His last set of vids that went out for AA were pretty bad but he seems to have definitely stepped it up a lot with both C and F moons (more C than F though lol)


~00:41
Yum

~2:05
lol what? anything would have been better than what he did here for IH combo. oh well

~3:12
Dunno why this got buffed but whatever! lol =D

CL was going for some "odd" combo followups. Guess he's still trying to figure out what's what. ZZzz where are Tsa and Yumekami troll F-ciel already? =/
zar are you even aware that your attitude is what drove people off in the first place. i think zar's attitude is worse than all of that. cause neither of you guys mean anything. but zar can poison shit around him. zar's the one that gets personal online and does realtalk that's out of line.

Offline AARP|ZTB

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #9 on: September 02, 2010, 11:45:25 AM »
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11959192 ~13:00

B-cmd looking really good. Damage looks fair and it seems as if there may be some higher dmg possibilities from it or at least messed up setups post-combo. As for the player, too much IAD'ing to reset strings (got blown up a few times for that), couldn't seem to even get combos started. Oh well, at least a B-cmd combo was well shown off.


BnB EDIT:

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11957757 ~6:00 - 7:40

@6:28
Old bnb doing ASS dmg (3.8k)

@6:58
NEW BnB!! lol (4.6k)

5A>5A>5B>5C>214A>2B>BE5C>delay 236A>5A>5C>Aerial


Check out the range where the combo is started....pretty damn far I must say. The speculations about 214A increased speed seems to hold weight and I'm pretty damn sure 5C>214A would not have connected from that far in AA. Looks like F-Ciel is still holding her own in the dmg dept.  ;D

On another note, I'm kinda sad that JP really thinks so little of this character (just check some of the comments/commentary). Man, TJDK.


EDIT2:

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11958636 ~12:00

More of the same player (?). I'm getting tight watching this guy...until he gets in lol. He makes the most of his in-game but doesn't seem to know how to utilize mid-range tools effectively to force mistakes. But whatever, a win is a win. . .
« Last Edit: September 02, 2010, 01:57:08 PM by ZARtacus! »
zar are you even aware that your attitude is what drove people off in the first place. i think zar's attitude is worse than all of that. cause neither of you guys mean anything. but zar can poison shit around him. zar's the one that gets personal online and does realtalk that's out of line.

Offline Relunx

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #10 on: September 23, 2010, 01:26:16 AM »
Can someone translate the framedata of F-Ciel?

Tnx in advance!

Relunx
« Last Edit: September 23, 2010, 01:32:59 AM by Relunx »

Offline AARP|ZTB

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2010, 01:20:14 PM »
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm12386434 [~6:45]

continued
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm12386787 [start - 2:00]

Seems the player may have been trolling first match. Second match displays more aggression, precision and focus. Still think jp plays down F-ciel midrange spacing far too often (zero use of optimal range 2B and 236B). Also, jp still seems to think this character is bad for w/e reason despite still being able to shell out meterless 5K dmg in bnbs.
zar are you even aware that your attitude is what drove people off in the first place. i think zar's attitude is worse than all of that. cause neither of you guys mean anything. but zar can poison shit around him. zar's the one that gets personal online and does realtalk that's out of line.

Offline Chie Satonaka

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2010, 05:16:02 PM »
J.C (CH) 1-hit 4C  xx 236C  :V

This guy...

Although the first match was him clearly trolling when he got on the offensive, it looked like to me he was more offensive the 1st game than the 2nd game. Although that could be due to the Hisui just being scared, I mean he did let F-Ciel dash back in from a max range 5(C). To me in the 2nd game he seemed more passive than anything else. A couple of times he tried to play rushdown the Hisui wasn't letting him have it, compared to the 1st game.

The only thing I can say about Japan thinking F-Ciel is a bad character is this...Ciel was one of those characters that was easy to pick up and scrub out with at low levels, but at higher levels of play she got harder to win with (This explains why despite Ciel being top tier in AC, there wasn't anyone really winning anything big with her sort of like GGXX/ KY). In Actress Again you have F-Ciel, who requires more effort to win with and in IMO a bit more linear than C-Ciel. Only reason I can think of Japan not really seeing F-Ciel as a good character is because none of the known AC Ciel players are really using her or trying to break her down...they're all sticking with C-Ciel. Deguchi, Niiya, ABD, Yumekami, all use C-Ciel for the most part. No one is really trying to break the character down in Japan and it's pretty apparent in how frequent we see them in matches, having Garu and Chelsea tell you she doesn't exist in Japan, and when you DO see them it's very under-whelming seeing her not use this character to her max potential...and let's be real...that is the case at this point  and time.

Semi-long rant, TL;DR she isn't really a bad character, just under-developed. Wanna see a bad version of Ciel? Look at H-Ciel.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2010, 05:18:31 PM by Ciel Is The Love Of My Life »
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Offline Relunx

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #13 on: October 13, 2010, 12:31:34 AM »
So basically JP people thinking Ciel is bad charater coz it's hard to win with her at/against high level? That's lame and lazy. F-Ciel can do an easy meteless 5k combo on almost anyone, is there any other char that can do that? I can't understand why JP people look donw on her. She has a large variety of moves both close and full range, not to mention her anti air moves. You'll never be safe no matter where are you, coz Ciel can pull out a move that can reach you. Sure she doesn't has Hiero but she doesn't need that.

Relunx

Offline Chie Satonaka

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #14 on: October 13, 2010, 07:33:48 AM »
So basically JP people thinking Ciel is bad charater coz it's hard to win with her at/against high level? That's lame and lazy.

I'm not saying that's the reason why Japan thinks of F-Ciel as a bad character, I'm saying that's how she was designed. She's been like this since AC Ver.A...her worst iteration next to H-Ciel. Don't get it twisted she can still win at high levels, but she has to put in more effort to do so the better you and your competition gets. That's why I lol when I hear people say Ciel was broken in AC.

Quote
F-Ciel can do an easy meteless 5k combo on almost anyone, is there any other char that can do that?

In Ver.A and PS2 this really isn't a big deal considering a good chunk of the cast can do this as long as they sneeze on you. In CC, sure she's one of the few characters who can hit 5K meterless, but it's nowhere near as consistent as it was in previous versions. Unless they got a jump-in or started with 5B it wasn't really doing much more than 4.4-4.6K and even the combo itself is super fickle mid-screen from what I've seen of it...at least compared to her flicker combos in ver.A/PS2.

Quote
I can't understand why JP people look donw on her.

It's not that Japan looks down on her, it's just that there's hardly anyone willing to be "that guy" and break out of their comfort zone. They're sticking to what they know...and TBH I can't hate them for that. Why do that if what you know is working out great for you?

Quote
She has a large variety of moves both close and full range, not to mention her anti air moves. You'll never be safe no matter where are you, coz Ciel can pull out a move that can reach you.

This isn't exclusive to F-Ciel. Ciel by default always had at least one or two great anti-air moves and as long as you had meter you were never truly safe because of the threat of EX-Hiero.

Quote
Sure she doesn't has Hiero but she doesn't need that.

Sure she doesn't NEED it, but I'd argue to the end that it sure as hell made some of her match-ups easier.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2010, 07:37:07 AM by Ciel Is The Love Of My Life »
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Offline Relunx

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2010, 12:04:26 AM »
Don't get it twisted she can still win at high levels, but she has to put in more effort to do so the better you and your competition gets. That's why I lol when I hear people say Ciel was broken in AC.
As for me I like putting lots of efforts in one character, I'm not the lazy one. I like learning all the tactics and lil tricks that the charater has. And I have to disagree with you with the second part, MBAC Ciel is broken, coz some of her moves are lift her above all charaters, here some examples:
1. EX Hiero + combo after it
2. her clashing dash
3. her "not stopping momentum" air throw --> perfect oki/pressure
These things and many other minor things made her "broken" in AC. Don't get me wrong, sure you have to play her well, but if you think a lil bit you'll understand that no other char can did those things back in AC and those things helped you a lot, making your play much (c)easyer.

The easy 5k meterless combo I was reffering to her new combo that includes the 214a+flickers.

Quote
It's not that Japan looks down on her, it's just that there's hardly anyone willing to be "that guy" and break out of their comfort zone. They're sticking to what they know.
I understand. It's hard to change from your good ol' "save" genereal style to a "risky" new one. But change is that moves you forward/evolve.

Quote
This isn't exclusive to F-Ciel. Ciel by default always had at least one or two great anti-air moves and as long as you had meter you were never truly safe because of the threat of EX-Hiero.
I have to disagree. C/H Ciel hasn't got a good move (special) that can stop a close range ground opponent.
On the contrary F-Ciel has flickers cmd throws and 214c. And EX-Hiero can be baited easyly.

Quote
Sure she doesn't NEED it, but I'd argue to the end that it sure as hell made some of her match-ups easier.
True. But I don't like easy wins. One of the reasons I'm maining F-Ciel nowadays is: she doesn't has EX-Hiero.

Relunx
« Last Edit: October 14, 2010, 12:06:42 AM by Relunx »

Offline Lord Knight

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #16 on: October 14, 2010, 03:40:10 AM »
So basically JP people thinking Ciel is bad charater coz it's hard to win with her at/against high level? That's lame and lazy.

I'm not saying that's the reason why Japan thinks of F-Ciel as a bad character, I'm saying that's how she was designed. She's been like this since AC Ver.A...her worst iteration next to H-Ciel. Don't get it twisted she can still win at high levels, but she has to put in more effort to do so the better you and your competition gets. That's why I lol when I hear people say Ciel was broken in AC.

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F-Ciel can do an easy meteless 5k combo on almost anyone, is there any other char that can do that?

In Ver.A and PS2 this really isn't a big deal considering a good chunk of the cast can do this as long as they sneeze on you. In CC, sure she's one of the few characters who can hit 5K meterless, but it's nowhere near as consistent as it was in previous versions. Unless they got a jump-in or started with 5B it wasn't really doing much more than 4.4-4.6K and even the combo itself is super fickle mid-screen from what I've seen of it...at least compared to her flicker combos in ver.A/PS2.

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I can't understand why JP people look donw on her.

It's not that Japan looks down on her, it's just that there's hardly anyone willing to be "that guy" and break out of their comfort zone. They're sticking to what they know...and TBH I can't hate them for that. Why do that if what you know is working out great for you?

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She has a large variety of moves both close and full range, not to mention her anti air moves. You'll never be safe no matter where are you, coz Ciel can pull out a move that can reach you.

This isn't exclusive to F-Ciel. Ciel by default always had at least one or two great anti-air moves and as long as you had meter you were never truly safe because of the threat of EX-Hiero.

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Sure she doesn't has Hiero but she doesn't need that.

Sure she doesn't NEED it, but I'd argue to the end that it sure as hell made some of her match-ups easier.
:prinny: :prinny: :prinny: :prinny: :prinny:

this char is fucking bs are you kidding me
Keep climbin', gotta get to the top

Offline Relunx

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #17 on: October 14, 2010, 04:54:42 AM »
:prinny: :prinny: :prinny: :prinny: :prinny:
this char is fucking bs are you kidding me
bs? bullshit?
Maybe can you explain it?

Just bcoz she's not fitting for your style or gameplay, it doesn't mean she's a bad character.

Relunx

Offline Lord Knight

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #18 on: October 14, 2010, 06:11:44 AM »
Keep climbin', gotta get to the top

Offline ehrik

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #19 on: October 14, 2010, 08:48:37 AM »
OS-Ciel
<Graven> When you are Ciel, don't try to win, don't even try to do anything. The more you do, the stupider and bigger faggot you become because you're using Ciel.
<WyvernLord> roku is faking his disappearance so melty bread can come out and try to convince him of his value to the community

Offline Kirah

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #20 on: October 14, 2010, 11:35:29 AM »
People really don't know shit about this character and it really is disgusting especially when a certain someone forged this character in its entirety I firmly believe she's the only real S-Tier char, and since this character has been unexplored she has been buffed for CC. Prepare to be sad take this from someone who fights this char's creator on a week/monthly basis. Despite having amazing footsies and just an overall great movelist she's the deadlier then any char in the game. So take a step back and really take in what you see in the tutorial vids that has been linked. This character is the embodiment of the word 'options' and in no way shape or form be underestimated, but this character requires dedication in order to remember all of her options. They're so many that not even Bifford can remember them all and she keeps evolving even now...

Offline MissedFRC

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #21 on: October 14, 2010, 11:47:29 AM »
God damn.
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<Saya> fuck all of you
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Offline Relunx

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #22 on: October 14, 2010, 12:52:46 PM »
Realy don't get these "two words" answers or some link.
Isn't it hard to explain it clearly? Well I guess I expect too much or ppl here is unable to speak normally.

Other:
Her new combo "(jc),5abc,214a,2b,5[c],236a,5ac, jbc, jbc, j22b, air throw" as far as I saw it worked only in corner, if used in midscreen the 2b is whiff after the 214a.
Anyone, comments?

Relunx

Offline AARP|ZTB

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #23 on: October 14, 2010, 03:13:26 PM »
Lol ppl posting in this thread who aren't Brandino or Zar? :psyduck:

Vanilla, Ver.A
F-ciel design presented a fresh, original, and "cool" character concept. Moves such as Flicker Hi/Low and cmd throw along with a few varied normals allowed this rendition of ciel to viewed in a different light, setting her play style and objectives apart from the C/H forms (IMO). In spite of such innovation, the character was still lacking esp. in comparison to her prevalent crescent form.

PS2/Console
So how exactly was the Ver.A (and obsolete vanilla) form of F-ciel "lacking"? Well, for one, tweaks to her JC complemented one of her exclusive specials, low flicker. This quick striking, mid-ranged attack allowed her to force a down at midscreen then by use of the JC, set up crossup attacks on wakeup. With the absence of a crossup jump attack in Ver.A, followups from landing a low flicker were pretty much useless as the most you'd get was a small otg that led to a wakeup game which was hardly intimidating. In addition, JC expanded hitbox also contributed to her aerial spacing and neutral game, allowing F-ciel to attack from many angles. The other "minor" change, which was given to all moon styles, was the untechable airthrow. For Ver.A C-Ciel, JB on decent allowed for punish against forward teching, but F-ciel had no such option as this form lacked a crossup attack, again making the previous F-ciel form extra weak. This is irrelevant to console as the airthrow is now completely untechable but considering the Ver.A F-ciel had one less option was enough reason to question her existence (lol). Amazing how two simple changes made the character "playable".

CC
Unfortunately, the Jp MB scene won't touch console fighters w/ a 10ft. pole, so it's safe to say that the majority of the community was fully unaware of F-ciel's developments since then. Enter CC: Console MBAA non-existent, Many unjustified buffs to a "bad/joke character", Jp MB scene oblivious due to community stigma. The devs are either dumb as fuck or they really wanted this character to become an above average competitor. If the latter, then I must say they did an excellent job. Buffs and tweaks to Bcmd throw (which was nearly useless even in console, but F-ciel was still able to manage overall), faster A knife (why?), practically no recovery on 214C knife (you really want me to spam knife set all day...okay then), increased untechtime on BE5C allowing for even more fucked up loops that pretty much give her Ver.A/Console dmg for bnbs (gj, fellas), and finally, though this is a rumor atm, lowered hitbox on High Flicker leaving no one safe to random 236B>iad spam AND opening up more opportunities to get more dmg from random hits like 2B.

Considering all of these buffs (CC), not to mention the other bullshit SHE ALREADY HAD, Japan still believes F-ciel = www because they, much like the US fg communities, have far too many followers and not enough innovators. If they ever manage to get their heads out of C-ciel's ass they may come to realize that perhaps the F-style may also be a force to be acknowledged. Until then, we'll just have to settle for our once-a-month poverty F-ciel viewings.  :emo:
« Last Edit: October 14, 2010, 03:18:38 PM by ZARtacus! »
zar are you even aware that your attitude is what drove people off in the first place. i think zar's attitude is worse than all of that. cause neither of you guys mean anything. but zar can poison shit around him. zar's the one that gets personal online and does realtalk that's out of line.

Offline MissedFRC

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Re: [MBAACC] Full Moon Ciel Discussion Thread
« Reply #24 on: October 14, 2010, 04:21:38 PM »
+heat Zar. Great vids and that was a neat read.
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