Tier List

[kos-mos...]

I play Ciel and lose to Ren a lot

[FireBearHero]

I agree 99% with OP tier list. Only thing is Kohaku is A imho. I'm surprised the japanese put vAkiha where they do, too.

[S-Blade]

Melty Blood's tiers (at least as of now, before actress again arrives and does god knows what) are very close together. If one of the players is a genuinely better player who is experiencing an even matchup situation, the only reason (tier-wise) s/he should lose is if s/he's using one of the nekos.

[Lord Knight]

I agree 99% with OP tier list. Only thing is Kohaku is A imho. I'm surprised the japanese put vAkiha where they do, too.

Based on sp00ky's post, Japanese players based their tiers on current performance. V Akiha has been doing really shitty in Japan till Hato came back on the scene.

[Zaido]

reason VSion is up there cause all the VSion player are awesome.. like oyashiro, motomachi and stuff !!

[asdfqwer]

Based on sp00ky's post, Japanese players based their tiers on current performance. V Akiha has been doing really shitty in Japan till Hato came back on the scene.

Yeah, the only reason Warcueid is S tier in Korea is because those players has done so well in tournaments. I wonder if Sion would have been S tier had Kubo not used her... 

[c-nero 5[c]]

Based on sp00ky's post, Japanese players based their tiers on current performance. V Akiha has been doing really shitty in Japan till Hato came back on the scene.

Yeah, the only reason Warcueid is S tier in Korea is because those players has done so well in tournaments. I wonder if Sion would have been S tier had Kubo not used her... 

Same could be said for Akiha and Yukinose.

[F9|Chibi]

Miyako is a fucking monster, bitch is scary as fuck when she gets in on you, more then any other character in the game imho.

I agree with the op list.

[Frostbolt]

Miyako on a Hisui, dead

In Korea, Warc is considered S? :O

Yeah, there is a saying "then just use warc and stfu" that is used whenever somebody complains about their character's weaknesses, their character's matchups, or their skill in general in Korea. As there are few or no competitive sion players in Korea, warc boasts the most amount of competitive players, highest showing in the high brackets of tournaments, and is the primary subject of the I-Lost-Only-Because-Your-Character-Is-Better-Than-Mine comment.

In smash we say 'No Johns'

Which means no excuses, I love the korean thinking

[Tare]

Here's my 2 cents. I really don't know why Kohaku and Aoko were ranked pretty low, they have some ridiculous setups.

S: Sion, Len, Akiha, Ciel
A: Hisui, Mech-Hisui, Aoko, Kohaku(Maids), Miyako, Warc
B: V.Sion, V.Akiha, Nanaya, Satsuki, Kohaku, Arc, Kouma, Hisui(Maids), Tohno, Nero
C: Wara, W.Len

Not sure if I'd keep V.Akiha at A or B. But due to the fact that she's a kind of instable character cause of her poor defense mod, I'll keep her a tier lower.

[F9|Chibi]

Aoko sucks.

[Veleon]

That may be true, but I think she is fun to play. What's cooler than having laser eye? It could only be shooting a laser out of your foot.

[Tare]

Aoko sucks.

Why?

1) She has good 3C anti-air then can catch alot of jump startups that's also cancellable into blockstring on block.
2) Solid oki setups that allow her to re-dash with the help of orb position.
3) Plenty of throw setups that reset back into orb pressure.
4) Numerous overheads that lead to knockdown into setup. ( Even 4C when coupled with 214A/B/C orbs).
5) Practical fuzzy guard setups.
6) Decent defense mod.
7) 3 Air Jumps and 2 Air dashes for aided corner pressure.
8 ) Decent guard break options.
9) Decent damage.
10) Anti-air shyoruken that for no reason at all is possible to combo follow up if they don't tech, or if they do allows you to tech punish if you call it.
11) Practical tech punish setups.
12) If your opponent respects you enough, you can do some really strong air to ground strings with j.C/j.B/j.214/j.236, especially in the corner.

The list goes on. I seriously don't see how she sucks when you compare pros and cons.

[asdfqwer]

Aoko sucks.

Why?

1) She has good 3C anti-air then can catch alot of jump startups that's also cancellable into blockstring on block.
2) Solid oki setups that allow her to re-dash with the help of orb position.
3) Plenty of throw setups that reset back into orb pressure.
4) Numerous overheads that lead to knockdown into setup. ( Even 4C when coupled with 214A/B/C orbs).
5) Practical fuzzy guard setups.
6) Decent defense mod.
7) 3 Air Jumps and 2 Air dashes for aided corner pressure.
8 ) Decent guard break options.
9) Decent damage.
10) Anti-air shyoruken that for no reason at all is possible to combo follow up if they don't tech, or if they do allows you to tech punish if you call it.
11) Practical tech punish setups.
12) If your opponent respects you enough, you can do some really strong air to ground strings with j.C/j.B/j.214/j.236, especially in the corner.

The list goes on. I seriously don't see how she sucks when you compare pros and cons.

The main reason she sucks is that priority on her basics are extremely bad. Without orbs, she is said to be at heavy disadvantage against other characters in general fighting. But this is talking at Tougeki level play. That is, these differences won't be obvious unless Aoko and the opponent is at a very very high level of play.

CL(extremely high level Ciel player) stated himself that he felt Aoko was at too much of a disadvantage against high priority characters. When he went to Japan, he said he was able to beat high level Aoko players only because he could stuff every move Aoko had with Ciel's priority.

As for my opinion... I don't know, I suck and get beaten by Aoko all the time

[Sledeau]

reflecting in no way of how good the actual characters are, just my opinion based on what I think other North America players opinions are:

S: Sion, Ciel, Warc, Len
A: Aoko, V Sion, Akiha, Nanaya, Hisui, Kouma, Satsuki
B: Shiki, Arc, V Akiha, Meido Tag Team, Nero, Mech Hisui
C: Miyako, Kohaku
Warakia, White Len, Necos

[linalys]

The list goes on. I seriously don't see how she sucks when you compare pros and cons.

3c is NOT good anti air.  It just isn't.  623a is better.  Now 3c is good at beating anticipated jumps and can be safe on block. 

Points 2-12 (except for 6 obviously) require Aoko to have the advantage to matter.  If she doesn't have the momentum, those points don't matter.  Saying you have an awesome high/low setup when you have an orb on them in the corner DOESN'T MATTER if you can't get them into the corner with an orb on top of them.  It can be very hard for this to actually happen.  Like was stated, Aoko's normals aren't the best.  She can have a bit of a hard time trying to get anything started with just her normals. 

You also need to specify point 11.  What exactly is her great tech punish setup? 

Edit: I need to add that I don't believe she sucks but she's not godly either. 

[FireBearHero]

You guys forgot to mention that Aoko is practically immune to cross-ups.

Not only should you have an orb above you somewhere whenever possible, but you can just press 5B and go right through a bunch of shit. (not kohaku; the god of "how the fuck did that just hit me?")
I can't tell you how many times my Miyako playing friend whiffing right through me and eating shit has saved me. (could be more)

Aoko's 5B is the most rewarding move in this game for psychic-esque twitch players IMO, hands down.

[Lord Knight]

V Akiha is an A tier character.

[Pfhor]

Here's my 2 cents. I really don't know why Kohaku and Aoko were ranked pretty low, they have some ridiculous setups.

S: Sion, Len, Akiha, Ciel
A: Hisui, Mech-Hisui, Aoko, Kohaku, Miyako, Warc
B: V.Sion, V.Akiha, Nanaya, Arc, Satsuki, Kouma, Maids, Tohno, Nero
C: Wara, W.Len

Not sure if I'd keep V.Akiha at A or B. But due to the fact that she's a kind of instable character cause of her poor defense mod, I'll keep her a tier lower.

If Kohaku is in A tier it should be her Maids counterpart. :|

[lain102300]

Like lina said, Aoko's 3c isn't really good anti-air. However, it is good for clipping people who are starting to jump. So while it won't stuff jump-ins, it will punish people who like to jump after blockstrings, after blocking orbs, after backdashing, etc.

On another note, poor Warakia really has the shit piled on him. Remember, despite his crap tier reputation, Shonen using Warakia in SBO 2006 got pretty far. It could be that if more people actually bothered to use him at all, he'd be higher up in the tier list. Just off the top of my head, I'll list a few of his good points:

1) Top-tier dash. Although it doesn't have Ciel's ZOMG clash frames, it covers ground and keeps him low to the ground.
2) Range. Sure in MBAC zoning isn't as useful in general, but it never hurt. Warakia, I will argue, has more tools than average to avoid being rush down. His crappy initial HP puts him at a disadvantage early, but Warakia really shines in end-game when both sides have low HP and are just looking to get that last poke or combo in.
3) One of the best DP in the game. Warakia's 623c is a wonderful thing. It comes out fast and comes out straight above him. I've caught a lot of jump happy players just by doing dash --> 623C. Works really well against ring-spamming Warcs.
4) Decent oki. Granted, VSion's shadows make Warakia's look retarded. But as a whole, Warakia's shadows aren't terrible. Nero blocks people from jumping. Nanaya blocks people from backdashing. And Akiha is an overhead. A slow overhead, but an overhead nonetheless.
5) Overall, the basic gameplan of Warakia is to play keepaway until you can use his high mobility to grind out a combo. It's not the most top tier strategy, but Warakia can do it well. He has shadows, tornadoes, long normals, etc that keep the other player at a distance, a situation where Warakia does best. He can do respectable damage with meter and can grind down the clock if he wants to. His biggest flaw is that once the opponent gets close, he has a difficult time pushing back. But then again, a lot of characters don't deal with rush down well.

[c-nero 5[c]]

Wara basically suffers from the same "huge hitbox" problem as chaos, but his moveset is for the most part inferior to chaos'. The only scary thing about him are his nero summon mixups and those are a lot easier to escape than many other mixups. He is a fair bit faster than chaos but his limited mixups and inferior airgame as well as his inferior zoning put him lower in tiers than chaos, who is already low-mid in almost everybody's tier list. that's the main reason he's so often tiered low. On top of that, Warakia is perhaps one of the most reliant on whiff cancelling characters in the game, right up there with Nanaya and Hisui, and his damage will plummet very early in a match.

[Frostbolt]

Sabator didnt you quit MB?

Miyako C << WUT

[WickedElement]

Sabator didnt you quit MB?

Miyako C << WUT

 

[Tare]

The list goes on. I seriously don't see how she sucks when you compare pros and cons.

3c is NOT good anti air.  It just isn't.  623a is better.  Now 3c is good at beating anticipated jumps and can be safe on block. 

Points 2-12 (except for 6 obviously) require Aoko to have the advantage to matter.  If she doesn't have the momentum, those points don't matter.  Saying you have an awesome high/low setup when you have an orb on them in the corner DOESN'T MATTER if you can't get them into the corner with an orb on top of them.  It can be very hard for this to actually happen.  Like was stated, Aoko's normals aren't the best.  She can have a bit of a hard time trying to get anything started with just her normals. 

You also need to specify point 11.  What exactly is her great tech punish setup? 

Edit: I need to add that I don't believe she sucks but she's not godly either. 

Yeah, I was meaning the early jump catch for 3C, but I didn't really know how to term that so I just put anti-air. But I mean in some instances I also seeing it have potential to trade hits for CH air to ground. As for getting the knockdown, her j.A seems to be pretty good air to air, although it does have short range, so does everyones. She can trade off CH with her 214 if they try to air to ground her. Aoko 123 sweep into 623A into the corner you can tech punish neutral, back and forward and if they dont tech it's like free damage. Also throwing, and if they don't do anything you can setup orb. I mean she doesn't have amazing setups like Miyako with 22 or Akiha with j.2C but she atleast has the option to force more damage. 236A is also a stable for mid range air jump or poke attempts that can possibly score CH's. It may be harder to get the knockdown only relying on her normals, but I dont think that factor alone would make her 'suck'. I see your point that having momentum is key in any fighting game but a lot of characters wouldn't be so great if points were invalidated just because they don't momentum. Like Akiha, with the exception of her quick 2C/2B and risky 4C to counter re-dashin pressures. Akiha without her tech options, flamepit setups, instant j.2C overhead would definitely not be top tier. kimjjo makes a nice point about the prioritiy thing, and is why I didn't put Aoko that up. Of course she'd probably have a bad matchup against someone like Ciel or perhaps Miyako, though I'd still fear a good Aoko over a good Miyako. I do agree with lina that it might be quite harder to get an orb setup in the corner because you'd literally have to combo them in the corner or somewhere close, but her midscreen orb setups aren't too, too bad either.

[Tare]

Here's my 2 cents. I really don't know why Kohaku and Aoko were ranked pretty low, they have some ridiculous setups.

S: Sion, Len, Akiha, Ciel
A: Hisui, Mech-Hisui, Aoko, Kohaku, Miyako, Warc
B: V.Sion, V.Akiha, Nanaya, Arc, Satsuki, Kouma, Maids, Tohno, Nero
C: Wara, W.Len

Not sure if I'd keep V.Akiha at A or B. But due to the fact that she's a kind of instable character cause of her poor defense mod, I'll keep her a tier lower.

If Kohaku is in A tier it should be her Maids counterpart. :|

Oh right, usually when I see Kohaku, I just assume maids, lawlz.