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Regional Community / Re: SoCal Mega Thread
« on: October 13, 2007, 02:02:42 AM »
Lol. some surprise meeting you guys at AI today, specially you mason and Arli. GG's tonight.
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ahaha that's no--wait, what?
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Akiha's Tea Room / Re: On shortcomings, and overcoming them.
« on: October 04, 2007, 06:51:01 PM »
I like to attempt to run underneath my opponent against a jump in.... only to get crossed over and horribly punished. 
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Tournament Results / Re: West Toast 7 Results! (Preliminary before we actually wake up)
« on: October 01, 2007, 11:46:38 AM »Yeah, let me just get the bracket screen shotted and post it up.
*EDIT* bracket up.
I'm Eric. lol
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Tournament Results / Re: West Toast 7 Results! (Preliminary before we actually wake up)
« on: September 30, 2007, 06:28:41 AM »
I think i was the 4th Place man
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Tournaments and Events / Re: West Toast: Killer 7 - Saturday, September 29th - Interface (CA)
« on: September 05, 2007, 10:24:53 PM »I might show. If only for the pizza. And the beer. And maybe to money match people...
...at RPS.
rock paper scissor?
SKizzors!
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Tournaments and Events / Re: West Toast: Killer 7 - Saturday, September 29th - Interface (CA)
« on: September 05, 2007, 06:34:33 PM »
Aiming for the top!! xD
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Nero Chaos (Nrvnqsr) / Re: Facing Nero at the recieving end: Those damn pets.
« on: September 03, 2007, 05:26:09 PM »
I meant this thread to further mention about Nero's summons, even if it is in a different context. The fact that there is a post about hating on Nero's summons in the first place obviously hints to the fact that the summons are, in fact, useful and effective. And besides, Arlieth said it himself back at the tournament results post for the Evo thread.
If that alone doesnt merit this thread being here then it always can be deleted or moved.
My 2 cents. 8)
You need to look a little harder at how I play Nero. As much as we joke about j.C, it's really the summons that kill people- even if they don't get hit by them...
If that alone doesnt merit this thread being here then it always can be deleted or moved.
My 2 cents. 8)
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Nero Chaos (Nrvnqsr) / Facing Nero at the recieving end: Those damn pets.
« on: September 03, 2007, 12:19:28 PM »
When it comes to facing nero, its not the 4c's that i worry about: It's those damn pets: the 3 versions of the deer, the crow, that snake with the big mouth. they are all brutal set ups to lead to punishment if you're not careful.
While i cant say that i am the best when it comes to beating Nero, i do have an idea of what to look out for.
1: The deer: There are 3 versions: 1 hit- the deer jumps and disappears, 2 hit- the deer walks out then does 2 dashing attacks, ex (3 hit)- same as the 2 hit but the deer dashes three times.
-Between the 2 hit and the 3 hit versions, there is a small opening between each deer dash where you are vulnerable to a throw if you are on planted on the ground.
-careful when attacking between each deer dash, that guy luvs to counter your attempts, setting you up for a 4c combo
2: that snake: the once i fear the most is the one that eats you (dunno the version). Careful when trying to counter a snake attempt. Any bit of hit recovery that the snake catches you will result with you in being eaten.
3: The Crows: 1 shoots the crow like a quick projectile, another sets up a crow for a diagonal dash attack. The ex version sets up a barrage of crows for a diagonal dash attack. Beware of the possible set ups of the ex version. Trying to block a ex crow set up could make you get thrown. At the same token, trying to attack when the ex crows are out will result in a barrage of crows from going at you if even the slightest hitbox of your sprite is touching the path of the crows. Trying to jump block the crows could also set you up for an unblockable.
This is all i can think up being on the receiving end of Nero.
While i cant say that i am the best when it comes to beating Nero, i do have an idea of what to look out for.
1: The deer: There are 3 versions: 1 hit- the deer jumps and disappears, 2 hit- the deer walks out then does 2 dashing attacks, ex (3 hit)- same as the 2 hit but the deer dashes three times.
-Between the 2 hit and the 3 hit versions, there is a small opening between each deer dash where you are vulnerable to a throw if you are on planted on the ground.
-careful when attacking between each deer dash, that guy luvs to counter your attempts, setting you up for a 4c combo
2: that snake: the once i fear the most is the one that eats you (dunno the version). Careful when trying to counter a snake attempt. Any bit of hit recovery that the snake catches you will result with you in being eaten.
3: The Crows: 1 shoots the crow like a quick projectile, another sets up a crow for a diagonal dash attack. The ex version sets up a barrage of crows for a diagonal dash attack. Beware of the possible set ups of the ex version. Trying to block a ex crow set up could make you get thrown. At the same token, trying to attack when the ex crows are out will result in a barrage of crows from going at you if even the slightest hitbox of your sprite is touching the path of the crows. Trying to jump block the crows could also set you up for an unblockable.
This is all i can think up being on the receiving end of Nero.
834
Akiha's Tea Room / Re: Photos from Evolution 2k7
« on: August 31, 2007, 01:36:22 PM »F'in Schweet!!
1. Numakie with a slime on his head
<3
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Kohaku's Magical Garage / Re: Reverse Beat: Jab Canceling
« on: August 30, 2007, 10:08:12 PM »
Alot of good arguments coming from here. However, Zaido does say this in the simpliest manner.
And as for calling it either "Reverse Beat" or "Whiff canceling" Rei explains it best.
Mind that when I was making this thread, I kept in mind some random person who is interested in the game but doesn't quite know the game specifics. Ticking, for example, is something that any random person wouldn't know unless someone really explained that ticking is a means of trapping the opponent into a throw by means of poke stuns, getting them on wake up, or other means. Otherwise, it would be just throwing the guy. And besides, in this instance, between Reverse Beat and Whiff canceling, a larger percentage of people would know what whiff canceling is. Only we (meaning us who play the game seriously) would understand Reverse Beating.
Therefore, I'll refer to this tactic as "Whiff Canceling", since it is more easily understood to the masses.
Also, i changed the title of the thread and edited the first post accordingly. Thanks for your input.
More updates to this thread when i have the time.
all in all using A is whiff canceling with reverse beat property, but we shall keep it as whiff canceling since its easier to imagine and easier to understand.. end of story.. though we are not denying the reverse beat fact
And as for calling it either "Reverse Beat" or "Whiff canceling" Rei explains it best.
whiff canceling is a more universal term in fighting games, it would be better to use than reverse beat... If you say... (Reverse Beat)... like that, people could get confused with that you're talking about...
Mind that when I was making this thread, I kept in mind some random person who is interested in the game but doesn't quite know the game specifics. Ticking, for example, is something that any random person wouldn't know unless someone really explained that ticking is a means of trapping the opponent into a throw by means of poke stuns, getting them on wake up, or other means. Otherwise, it would be just throwing the guy. And besides, in this instance, between Reverse Beat and Whiff canceling, a larger percentage of people would know what whiff canceling is. Only we (meaning us who play the game seriously) would understand Reverse Beating.
Therefore, I'll refer to this tactic as "Whiff Canceling", since it is more easily understood to the masses.
Also, i changed the title of the thread and edited the first post accordingly. Thanks for your input.
More updates to this thread when i have the time.
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Hisui / Re: Hisui! The maid who makes exploding sammiches.
« on: August 30, 2007, 01:30:29 PM »
She suuuure does.. 
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Hisui / Re: Hisui! The maid who makes exploding sammiches.
« on: August 30, 2007, 01:27:42 PM »
Obviously we're not going to agree on anything. -.-
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Hisui / Re: Hisui! The maid who makes exploding sammiches.
« on: August 30, 2007, 12:43:30 PM »
You speak as though as the Throw in an air combo is absolute. Well i am saying that it is not the only option. Sure the throw has great tech punishing. properties but the option can also have the option of not teching. Do it enough and you feel like throwing a bento out, i can simply recover and throw the beat down on you because of the lag that setting the bento has, just to point an example. However there are situations where you simply cant land in a throw and have to rely on other options.
There are several ways to mix things up. Up in the air, you can either throw, j.BB or even do a qcf-A multi sachel. Each has their strengths, each has their weaknesses. Relying on 1 too much will make you too predictable. Thats why it is good to throw something out unexpected from time to time to knock the opponent off guard, or even to have different options. Basic concept of any fighting game.
Ill stop there for now
There are several ways to mix things up. Up in the air, you can either throw, j.BB or even do a qcf-A multi sachel. Each has their strengths, each has their weaknesses. Relying on 1 too much will make you too predictable. Thats why it is good to throw something out unexpected from time to time to knock the opponent off guard, or even to have different options. Basic concept of any fighting game.
Ill stop there for now
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Hisui / Re: Hisui! The maid who makes exploding sammiches.
« on: August 30, 2007, 11:47:41 AM »Oh, duh. I completely forgot. Mostly because I never use it
Yeah, it's a rarely used normal of hers. Not entirely bad, but not all that noteworthy either.
;p
I hate when that shiz comes out accidently @.@
Luckily i find that if it comes out, i can Double Jump and j.BB right afterword. Might as well make the most of a mistake.
j.2BB is not a move, and doing j.BB after an 'accidental' 6B is insanely bad. Just immediately jump up and do j.B j.C j.B j.C airthrow or pretty much ANYTHING into air throw.
j.bb Corrected ;P
6B sometimes has a tendency of launching an opponent already in the air too high to a point where you cant even connect anything afterword. Its all situational really
Also... you will never let go of me doing anything that is not an air throw, will you?
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Hisui / Re: Hisui! The maid who makes exploding sammiches.
« on: August 30, 2007, 11:16:08 AM »Oh, duh. I completely forgot. Mostly because I never use it
Yeah, it's a rarely used normal of hers. Not entirely bad, but not all that noteworthy either.
;p
I hate when that shiz comes out accidently @.@
Luckily i find that if it comes out, i can Double Jump and j2BB right afterword. Might as well make the most of a mistake.
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Kohaku's Magical Garage / Re: Reverse Beat: Jab Canceling
« on: August 30, 2007, 11:06:22 AM »
Alrighty, Changed the title just now. ill need to do more revisions with this thread when i have time. (at work atm 
)
)
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Kohaku's Magical Garage / Re: Jab Canceling
« on: August 30, 2007, 10:38:55 AM »I see your point about it being a variation of Reverse Beat. However from what i understand, Reverse Beats are only counted as Reverse Beats if they connect. This type of canceling i am trying to point out doesn't end up connecting, and yet players do use it in gameplay. Therefore, does whiffing A's in this manner really count as "Reverse Beat"?
If it doesnt, then what should it be called?
Just something to think about.
Also, ill definitely make mention of Reverse beats the second round of this thing.
No, you're seriously just talking about reverse beats Numakie.
Doing 2ABC into 5A on block = Reverse beat.
Doing 2C into 5A on block = Reverse beat.
Doing ANY NORMAL (except 5A) (if I'm not mistaken) on block into 5A = reverse beat.
With Hisui for example, a simple sample is to run up and to do 2B on a blocking opponent, then immediately do 5A. It recovers quickly, and tends to be followed with dash throw. That's using reverse beat.
What you're refering to is the fact that you can cancel into any normal after a jab again, block or whiff (though in this case you're specifying it in block strings). That's why some Hisui players will do 6C in a block string, then jump and j.A and then j.C to quickly cover the space to continue her rushdown.
Self Pwnd
Thanks for the correction.
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Kohaku's Magical Garage / Re: Jab Canceling
« on: August 30, 2007, 10:33:52 AM »
Does it really now. 
Guess ill need to further test it.
Oh well. im only human =P
Guess ill need to further test it.Oh well. im only human =P
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Kohaku's Magical Garage / Re: Jab Canceling
« on: August 30, 2007, 10:09:41 AM »
I see your point about it being a variation of Reverse Beat. However from what i understand, Reverse Beats are only counted as Reverse Beats if they connect. This type of canceling i am trying to point out doesn't end up connecting, and yet players do use it in gameplay. Therefore, does whiffing A's in this manner really count as "Reverse Beat"?
If it doesnt, then what should it be called?
Just something to think about.
Also, ill definitely make mention of Reverse beats the second round of this thing.
If it doesnt, then what should it be called?
Just something to think about.
Also, ill definitely make mention of Reverse beats the second round of this thing.
845
Kohaku's Magical Garage / Re: Jab Canceling
« on: August 30, 2007, 08:53:31 AM »'Jab canceling'?
Don't you just mean reverse beat, guy?
"Reverse Beat" is a form of Jargon to the MB community and is not something easily understood to the average person or someone who is new to the game, at least not at first. The reason I call it "Jab Canceling" is because that's how I remembered it when I first observed it, and it is a lingo that most people can understand. I, personally, didn't understand what Reverse Beating was until recently when Kyro explained the basics of it to me at Evo.
This section will refined over time. In the mean time feel free to give any input, whether it be character specifics, exceptions to the rule, etc.
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Kohaku's Magical Garage / Reverse Beat: Whiff Canceling
« on: August 29, 2007, 11:58:24 PM »
Update:
2007-08-20:11.11p : Changed the title to "Reverse Beat: Whiff Canceling" and changed the words in this post accordingly
2007-08-30: Changed the thread from "Jab Canceling" to "Reverse Beat: Jab Canceling"
Introduction
The Combo system of Melty Blood works in such a way that, provided that you are hitting the opponent, any normal hit can cancel into any normal hit. (ex: A cancels to B, C cancels to A) On the same token, once you do a move, you can't repeat that move in a single string once you used it. This applies to hitting the opponent whether he is blocking or not.
There is a slight different to hitting an opponent that is not blocking and one that is blocking. This will lead to 2 different kinds of options depending on the situation
If you manage to hit an opponent that is not blocking, you have the additional ability to "Jump Cancel", which means that you are able to cancel a normal move with a jump. It is well known when doing air combos from any sweep to another normal hit, you can immediately jump up in the air for pursuit. This is a basic concept of "Jump Canceling." It also means that you can hit a standing opponent with a B and jump right after word. Looking at this further, this brings along other options of "Counter Punishing', catching people in the air, or as other means of mix ups.
Most of the time though, before you will be able to land that hit, the opponent will be blocking, and that will limit your options with the strings that you will be able to use against your opponent. That means you will be strictly limited to canceling moves with a special move or waiting for something like a whiffed sweep to recover, which leave you screaming to the opponent "Hit me". Looking back to the concept that any normal move can cancel to any normal move, if you are met with this situation of hitting a blocking opponent, you will want to whiff something that gives the least amount of recovery. This leaves one possible option, the Jab A.
Whiff Canceling
Whiff Canceling refers to the use of whiffing a standing A in mid pressure against a blocking opponent. The reason why standing A is a good option is because a majority of moves from ground encounters are done using crouching moves. In most cases, standing moves will not be used unless in the middle of a combo. This leaves the standing A an available option to recover quickly since it isn't used much otherwise. In a combo string against a blocking opponent, a standing A that is whiffed will bring you back to a neutral state quickly. That means you can rush in and do every single one of your normal moves, then whiff an A, the do all your moves again.
This also give the player different options that are not available otherwise. Any move that otherwise has an extreme recovery can have an A whiffed right after for a quick recovery. Sweeps can be spammed against a grounded opponent. C's can be Whiff Canceled, only to follow up with another C. One can even throw an opponent after a Whiff Cancel, provided they are close enough to do so. Also, Depending on the situation, other moves can be canceled into provide that they haven't been used yet in a single string
Drawbacks
While this concept may sound like a godsend at first, there are some drawbacks with Whiff Canceling. First of all, a move can only be canceled if it actually connects against an opponent. This means that a normal move like a laggy C attack that doesn't connect will be just that... a laggy C attack. Whiff Canceling only assures that you can continue any pressure string used against an opponent. It will not prevent an opponent from blocking, countering, or shielding you. This concept is only considered as an additional means to use against an opponent. Also, depending on the character, some normal moves cannot be Whiff Canceled, or have other specific follow ups, thus not allowing the option to Whiff Cancel. Each character has its own use of this method, therefore using this tactic may take some experimenting or getting used to.
Conclusion
Aside from the drawbacks though, Whiff Canceling offers a solid option for recovering quickly in mid combo through the use of normal moves. It lessens the chance of moves that scream "Hit me" from staying out longer then it should. It is also universal from character to character, so each character has a means of using it in their own manner. While the use of this tactic may not win all your matches, it does present as a tool against players of a higher caliber. After all, the best way to attack or defend is to make sure that you are ready for it in the first place.
In closing, I'd like to say good luck on your matches. I hope this helps your gameplay.
2007-08-20:11.11p : Changed the title to "Reverse Beat: Whiff Canceling" and changed the words in this post accordingly
2007-08-30: Changed the thread from "Jab Canceling" to "Reverse Beat: Jab Canceling"
Introduction
The Combo system of Melty Blood works in such a way that, provided that you are hitting the opponent, any normal hit can cancel into any normal hit. (ex: A cancels to B, C cancels to A) On the same token, once you do a move, you can't repeat that move in a single string once you used it. This applies to hitting the opponent whether he is blocking or not.
There is a slight different to hitting an opponent that is not blocking and one that is blocking. This will lead to 2 different kinds of options depending on the situation
If you manage to hit an opponent that is not blocking, you have the additional ability to "Jump Cancel", which means that you are able to cancel a normal move with a jump. It is well known when doing air combos from any sweep to another normal hit, you can immediately jump up in the air for pursuit. This is a basic concept of "Jump Canceling." It also means that you can hit a standing opponent with a B and jump right after word. Looking at this further, this brings along other options of "Counter Punishing', catching people in the air, or as other means of mix ups.
Most of the time though, before you will be able to land that hit, the opponent will be blocking, and that will limit your options with the strings that you will be able to use against your opponent. That means you will be strictly limited to canceling moves with a special move or waiting for something like a whiffed sweep to recover, which leave you screaming to the opponent "Hit me". Looking back to the concept that any normal move can cancel to any normal move, if you are met with this situation of hitting a blocking opponent, you will want to whiff something that gives the least amount of recovery. This leaves one possible option, the Jab A.
Whiff Canceling
Whiff Canceling refers to the use of whiffing a standing A in mid pressure against a blocking opponent. The reason why standing A is a good option is because a majority of moves from ground encounters are done using crouching moves. In most cases, standing moves will not be used unless in the middle of a combo. This leaves the standing A an available option to recover quickly since it isn't used much otherwise. In a combo string against a blocking opponent, a standing A that is whiffed will bring you back to a neutral state quickly. That means you can rush in and do every single one of your normal moves, then whiff an A, the do all your moves again.
This also give the player different options that are not available otherwise. Any move that otherwise has an extreme recovery can have an A whiffed right after for a quick recovery. Sweeps can be spammed against a grounded opponent. C's can be Whiff Canceled, only to follow up with another C. One can even throw an opponent after a Whiff Cancel, provided they are close enough to do so. Also, Depending on the situation, other moves can be canceled into provide that they haven't been used yet in a single string
Drawbacks
While this concept may sound like a godsend at first, there are some drawbacks with Whiff Canceling. First of all, a move can only be canceled if it actually connects against an opponent. This means that a normal move like a laggy C attack that doesn't connect will be just that... a laggy C attack. Whiff Canceling only assures that you can continue any pressure string used against an opponent. It will not prevent an opponent from blocking, countering, or shielding you. This concept is only considered as an additional means to use against an opponent. Also, depending on the character, some normal moves cannot be Whiff Canceled, or have other specific follow ups, thus not allowing the option to Whiff Cancel. Each character has its own use of this method, therefore using this tactic may take some experimenting or getting used to.
Conclusion
Aside from the drawbacks though, Whiff Canceling offers a solid option for recovering quickly in mid combo through the use of normal moves. It lessens the chance of moves that scream "Hit me" from staying out longer then it should. It is also universal from character to character, so each character has a means of using it in their own manner. While the use of this tactic may not win all your matches, it does present as a tool against players of a higher caliber. After all, the best way to attack or defend is to make sure that you are ready for it in the first place.
In closing, I'd like to say good luck on your matches. I hope this helps your gameplay.
847
Hisui / Re: Hisui! The maid who makes exploding sammiches.
« on: August 29, 2007, 09:51:44 PM »
I guess ill add a bit of my experience with using this meido.
First the 2B properties
-2B counts as a Low Hit.
-Because of how long it stays out there, it makes a good meaty hit, thus the tech punishing property.
A few things to add about Hisui's "Arc Drive"
-This baby cant be shielded.
-At the moment of firing to the moment the fireball is launched, you are invincible and will recover quickly, if not instantly, and the end of the move. This gives this move counter properties and makes a decent wake up. It also can be an answer to getting out of an opponents pressure string if need be.
-Charging the move does 2 things
O It freezes all movements in the game temporarly.
O After the freeze, the fireball will gain an extra hit property the longer you charge it.
o The max you can charge the fireball is 8 hits (default is 3 hits)
o Letting go of the charge (if you choose to charge it) doesn't assure that the fireball will hit right away.
o <speculation> It seems that the fireball with only fire after a specific animation frame.
Random fact about 6C: If you land a Frying pan against a ducking opponent, it will force them in standing stun.
Thats all I can think of adding for now.
First the 2B properties
-2B counts as a Low Hit.
-Because of how long it stays out there, it makes a good meaty hit, thus the tech punishing property.
A few things to add about Hisui's "Arc Drive"
-This baby cant be shielded.
-At the moment of firing to the moment the fireball is launched, you are invincible and will recover quickly, if not instantly, and the end of the move. This gives this move counter properties and makes a decent wake up. It also can be an answer to getting out of an opponents pressure string if need be.
-Charging the move does 2 things
O It freezes all movements in the game temporarly.
O After the freeze, the fireball will gain an extra hit property the longer you charge it.
o The max you can charge the fireball is 8 hits (default is 3 hits)
o Letting go of the charge (if you choose to charge it) doesn't assure that the fireball will hit right away.
o <speculation> It seems that the fireball with only fire after a specific animation frame.
Random fact about 6C: If you land a Frying pan against a ducking opponent, it will force them in standing stun.
Thats all I can think of adding for now.
848
Tournament Results / Re: EVO WORLD MBAC SINGLES Results (Videos Coming Soon)
« on: August 28, 2007, 02:56:02 PM »
Does drinking count? 
849
Tournament Results / Re: EVO WORLD MBAC SINGLES Results (Videos Coming Soon)
« on: August 28, 2007, 01:38:03 PM »
Mad props to you, Wicked, for showing that little girls can kick ass.
850
Melty Blood Auditorium / Re: Stick or pad (or keyboard? o.O)?
« on: August 28, 2007, 01:02:59 PM »
Hori Stick
If need be though, i can be a Pad Warrior.
If need be though, i can be a Pad Warrior.